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Halo 5: Guardians Arena Gameplay Settings Thread

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My two cents on nice-to-have changes to an otherwise pretty strong competitive game (imo):

 

[*]slight nerf to AR ttk

 

[*]This won't be popular, but since I'm among friends... I'm fine with radar. I think much more is made of it than necessary and it's not negatively impactful on gameplay. I wouldn't be opposed to changing it to highlight spartan ability usage and firing only, but I do believe it has a place in this game's competitive gameplay and certainly don't think we've observed it to be the ruination of Halo. If 343 ultimately decides for whatever reason that it must be removed, they should keep movement sounds in place, with a slight nerf to your footstep sounds when moving slowly (they might need to do that anyway... point being, you should be able to quiet-walk). That said, I don't understand the desire or reasoning for removing radar and movement sounds, so if someone can help me on that one it would be appreciated.

 

Thanks for your post. I just quoted what I wanted to address.

 

For ARs: A nerf would be better than nothing, but why not just take it out completely? I don't see what spawning with an AR adds to the gameplay in terms of competitiveness or fun. Fun is obviously more subjective, but I think it's much more skillful to not be able to whip out an AR and spray for close range fights.

 

For radar: the question I would ask is what do you think radar adds to the game competitively? To me it takes away some of the need for prediction,

awareness, and communication and only adds the small skill of knowing when to watch your radar. My general thought about Halo is that the game shouldn't feed you information about the other team's position that you didn't earn. Looking at your radar to see what route a player is taking does not constitute earning the knowledge so much as having it given to you.

 

As far as sound, I might be in the minority here but I think that your footsteps should be silent. Again, hearing someone's footsteps doesn't represent you earning knowledge of the enemy's position so much as having it given to you.

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Meh. The OS works top mid because you can't get melted after picking it up, which you can with railgun. Think OS would be better top mid personally

 

 

Oh yeah for sure, I could understand that but I'm mainly talking about how Nest is a bit too powerful right now. OS would be interesting to play with but Railgun is a bit more powerful than OS in terms of play making, so I think that's why its up there.

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Oh yeah for sure, I could understand that but I'm mainly talking about how Nest is a bit too powerful right now. OS would be interesting to play with but Railgun is a bit more powerful than OS in terms of play making, so I think that's why its up there.

I know. The OS being top mid doesn't make nest powerful and I think it would improve the opening of the match. I absolutely agree with the camo and shotgun replacement though, Nest is too dominant for how exposed it should be.

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Nerf storm rifle health-damage and spawn speed.  it should still melt shields.

Place all power-ups/power weapons on neutral points of the map.

nerf the lunge-distance on the Hammer and make it a power weapon.

Get rid of the FUCKING ALARM on torque.  anybody else find that annoying AF?

2 thrusts for the ball carrier is ridiculous.... if you want to make the ball carrier powerful without being able to shoot, give them a melee lunge distance like the Hammer has.

 

More incoming.... at work

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Thanks for your post. I just quoted what I wanted to address.

 

For ARs: A nerf would be better than nothing, but why not just take it out completely? I don't see what spawning with an AR adds to the gameplay in terms of competitiveness or fun. Fun is obviously more subjective, but I think it's much more skillful to not be able to whip out an AR and spray for close range fights.

 

For radar: the question I would ask is what do you think radar adds to the game competitively? To me it takes away some of the need for prediction,

awareness, and communication and only adds the small skill of knowing when to watch your radar. My general thought about Halo is that the game shouldn't feed you information about the other team's position that you didn't earn. Looking at your radar to see what route a player is taking does not constitute earning the knowledge so much as having it given to you.

 

As far as sound, I might be in the minority here but I think that your footsteps should be silent. Again, hearing someone's footsteps doesn't represent you earning knowledge of the enemy's position so much as having it given to you.

 

I think you should absolutely keep foot sounds, weapon swap sounds, all of that unless you are crouched.  Saying that sound info is "Given to you" instead of "Earned" is like saying knowing an enemy was across the map because you saw them was "Given" to you and not "Earned"....  Hearing is a different sense yeah, but it is a real one just like vision and should be effective, unlike radar which is artificial.  Even when you hear opponents around you, you still need to be paying attention to know whether its an enemy or a teammate and be able to locate it quickly.

 

For radar, i see both arguments as having merit, but the No Radar argument is still just theoretical since nobody has actually played a significant amount with it.

they NEED to remove it from a playlist and let people play with it for a while to know how it changes things.  My gut tells me that no radar is better just from past experience,  but i dont actually know that is true yet.  343 needs to give us the opportunity to find that out with a no-radar, all gametype playlist.

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I think you should absolutely keep foot sounds, weapon swap sounds, all of that unless you are crouched.  Saying that sound info is "Given to you" instead of "Earned" is like saying knowing an enemy was across the map because you saw them was "Given" to you and not "Earned"....  Hearing is a different sense yeah, but it is a real one just like vision and should be effective, unlike radar which is artificial.  Even when you hear opponents around you, you still need to be paying attention to know whether its an enemy or a teammate and be able to locate it quickly.

 

For radar, i see both arguments as having merit, but the No Radar argument is still just theoretical since nobody has actually played a significant amount with it.

they NEED to remove it from a playlist and let people play with it for a while to know how it changes things.  My gut tells me that no radar is better just from past experience,  but i dont actually know that is true yet.  343 needs to give us the opportunity to find that out with a no-radar, all gametype playlist.

 

Well, footsteps aren't as big a deal in 4v4, but if they're too loud they can almost completely ruin 2v2's and 1v1's. They should definitely be much quieter than they are now.

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Well, footsteps aren't as big a deal in 4v4, but if they're too loud they can almost completely ruin 2v2's and 1v1's. They should definitely be much quieter than they are now.

I think they need to be relative to your movement speed. 

Crouching = Silent

Running = loud enough to notice as long as your paying attention

Sprinting = Hard to miss

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On Strongholds? Railgun is neutral, Camo favors Nest, and Shotgun favors Yard. I think the flow of that current setup is really good but is lopsided towards Nest because of Camo, when it is already a favorable position.

Plaza In general is blue side favored. Easy sniper in Slayer and easy camo in Strongholds.

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Plaza In general is blue side favored. Easy sniper in Slayer and easy camo in Strongholds.

 

Yeah but those are two very different modes. I actually would like to see a Camo in Slayer but because of its slower pace it allows more breathing room to break the Cinema/Nest setup, whereas Strongholds is constant action. Something along these lines:

 

Slayer – Sniper Top Nest, OS Top Mid, Hydra in Yard, Camo in the Elevator-Nook in Yard

Strongholds – Shotgun next to Lift, Railgun/Rockets/OS Top Mid, Camo in Yard Elevator

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I don't get why pros don't complain about initial spawn imbalances. I would be pretty mad having to play game five as blue side on Rig. Or having to play red side Slayer Eden.

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Kind of seems like h1 pistol starts are necessary in this game. It balances out autos, defensive movement abilities, and increases the pace of the game regardless of the gun's ease of use.

 

Ideally though:

 

-No sprint

-No thruster

-No radar

-No autos

-Faster power item timers

-H1 pistol starts

-Buffed movement & acceleration speed

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I love watching Halo 5 played competitively and love playing it. I think it's a great game and is not in desperate need of sandbox changes, but I do agree that there are some things that could be incremental improvements to the current gameplay. If they didn't happen though, it wouldn't be the end of Halo or anything.

 

My two cents on nice-to-have changes to an otherwise pretty strong competitive game (imo):

  • slight nerf to storm rifle so it matches SMG ttk
  • nerf to OP SMG/Storm respawn times
  • reduce amount of SMG/Storms on maps - there should never be more than two of these weapons on a map
  • slight nerf to AR ttk
  • increase current pistol clip size slightly
  • I think current pistol/BR/DMR balance is really good (I think 4sk pistol would be the most OP weapon in the game) provided the nerfs to autos described above, but wouldn't be opposed to a very slight increase in ROF. Just don't think there are any necessary changes here.
  • reduce Spartan Charge magnetism (you shouldn't be able to curve so significantly after your charge started)
  • This won't be popular, but since I'm among friends... I'm fine with radar. I think much more is made of it than necessary and it's not negatively impactful on gameplay. I wouldn't be opposed to changing it to highlight spartan ability usage and firing only, but I do believe it has a place in this game's competitive gameplay and certainly don't think we've observed it to be the ruination of Halo. If 343 ultimately decides for whatever reason that it must be removed, they should keep movement sounds in place, with a slight nerf to your footstep sounds when moving slowly (they might need to do that anyway... point being, you should be able to quiet-walk). That said, I don't understand the desire or reasoning for removing radar and movement sounds, so if someone can help me on that one it would be appreciated.
  • Reduce the amount of time a splinter grenade stays open - not entirely sure what it is now, but I'm thinking it should be about half that... it's absurd that you can win a battle, turn around a second later and die even though your shields are coming back up
I like the changes they've made to Riptide and Overgrowth and they might yet have a place in competitive gameplay. It also might be fun to have two snipers on Coliseum with reduced clips.

 

And I know we're talking HCS settings, but damn it would be nice if those two maps didn't come up every other game in Team Arena, and I would love to play Plaza Strongholds/Slayer a lot more than currently.

I might concede that a 4SK Magnum with the same level of bullet magnetism as the current 5SK would be questionable, but do realize that advocates of 4SK also want the Magnum's bullet magnetism to be reduced heavily, while the red reticle range would be slightly increased. This would lead to an overall more skillful weapon that is capable of enabling more creative and exciting plays, instead of forcing good players looking for power to resort to weapons governed by randomness, such as the SMG. My full thoughts on the subject can be found in the following link, but, needless to say, I don't think a 4SK Magnum that is harder to use would be "the most OP weapon in the game." http://teambeyond.net/forum/topic/5443-halo-5-guardians-discussion/?p=639495

 

Additionally (this is directed toward everyone), I've seen several posts saying that there needs to be a reason to pick up the BR/DMR, which is why the current weapon sandbox is fine. I have a question: what do the BR/DMR bring to the game that a 4SK Magnum wouldn't? What role do these weapons fill that is required for the game to function? I think that the answer to these questions is "nothing," which is precisely why people are afraid that these weapons would fall into obscurity. But I think we need to ask ourselves whether every weapon needs to be useful (or whether other weapons should be dragged down to enforce this "balance") for the sole sake of the weapon's existence and its identity. Team Beyond seems too pragmatic a community for that sentiment to make sense, especially in the post-H4 era.

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- Remove Radar 

- Buff pistol ROF or damage OR Nerf Automatics (preferably pistol buff as it would keep all kill times lower).

- Fix aiming if possible.

- Implement Forge maps that have actual sight lines as most maps have frustrating design allowing sprint/thruster to escape too easily.

- Trial CE pistol and Halo 2 BR starts. Just try it. Why not.

- Implement neutral Assault.

- Implement Oddball.

- Remove Overgrowth, I am yet to meet someone that likes it.

- Teams of 3 and 4 ONLY vs teams of 3 and 4. I'm sorry if you get a longer search time, but you won't ruin solo players' day either.

- Improve spectator mode.

- Allow "team" boosts instead of just individual boosts (promote teamwork possibly).

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I'd also like to throw out that I think the Storm Rifle is perfectly acceptable in its current state but needs to be placed perfectly on a map in a less than favorable position.

 

Did the storm rifle get nerfed in the last update? Your post implies that it is better now than it was previously. I have not played arena since the update so I'm just curious.

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Did the storm rifle get nerfed in the last update? Your post implies that it is better now than it was previously. I have not played arena since the update so I'm just curious.

 

 

No, it's the same strength. I think its current power is perfectly fine on maps like Rig and Plaza where you have to heavily sacrifice positioning and there is only one per map.

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bb99ac4bb1c2848e15735df77174a59d.jpg

Think he means by this, 343i's opinion on radar being removed not his. These downvotes are brutal lol

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Can we remove fuel rod from regret? I hate that fucking weapon.

 

Also. Keep the no radar going. +1 for the no radar posts :)

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Can we remove fuel rod from regret? I hate that fucking weapon.

 

Also. Keep the no radar going. +1 for the no radar posts :)

Railgun or Rockets pls
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I’ve decided to take the time to come up with changes I would make to weapon layouts on some specific maps/gametypes that come up in Team Arena.

 

Fathom

- Move Storm Rifles from Treehouses to the Submarines to have them in a more open area

- Add Railgun to top middle (Assault)

- Only have the ball spawn bottom mid. When it spawns red tree for example, it is extremely close to the red arming site (Assault)

 

Empire

- Remove OS

- Move Shotgun/Scattershot to current OS spawn

- Replace Plasma Caster with Rockets

- Place Sniper top tower

- Remove Storm Rifles

 

Plaza

-          Place Camo in Elevator (All modes)

-          Move shotgun to current Camo spawn  (Strongholds)

 

Regret

- Replace Fuel with Rockets

- Add Rockets to Assault

 

Riptide

- Can die in a fire

 

The Rig

- Leave Strongholds as is

- Swap Sniper and Plasma Caster spawns (Slayer)

 

Torque

- Add Rockets to Bottom Mid (All Modes)

- Remove Gravity Hammers and add one to top Middle (All Modes)

- Add a Sniper to each team’s Deck where Boltshots spawn (Start the game and go up the stairs to the right). This map is so long that this layout could give it a Narrows Feel (All Modes)

 

Truth

- Move Plasma Caster to top carbine so that people aren’t afraid to go for it.

- Move Sword to top mid

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I typed up a few notes...

 

 

 

Recommended Off-Season Changes (HWC)

  1. Automatic Nerfs

    1. Assault Rifle

      1. The perfect tap accuracy is great. It makes a burst-fired use of the weapon able to defend against pistols at significant range.

      2. The weapon is too oppressive versus precision weapons in close quarters. I would recommend increasing the recoil and spread when fired at Max ROF, encouraging players to pulse the trigger more when fighting up close. After all, that's why the bloom is there.

    2. Storm Rifle

      1. This weapon melts shields, but it also destroys health. Its range is in a good state, but it offers no time to react when coming around corners.

      2. I would recommend increasing the heat generation, in order to encourage more pulsing of the trigger – perhaps even make it so the only way to get a kill without overheating when trigger is held down is to land every single shot.

      3. Maybe also slightly reduce the projectile speed to offer more counterplay (with Thrust or other options.)

    3. SMG

      1. There's an interesting statistical trend regarding the SMG vs Storm Rifle at high levels of play, where the Storm Rifle's usage actually increases at high levels, but the AR/SMG both decrease the higher CSR the players involved are. I don't know if this is a mark that many people aren't aware the Storm Rifle is actually capable of killing (as Plasma weapons have traditionally not been good for that in Halo) or if people at high levels just think the SMG is inferior to the Storm.

      2. The SMG has a substantial amount of spread, but its insane RoF more than makes up for it. I would like to see a nerf to its damage-per-bullet or have its recoil increased to encourage more control of the bullet hose of hot lead bukkake.

    4. Suppressor

      1. This is the one Automatic that sees almost no usage at the top level, and I haven't discerned whether this is due to its slow start-up RoF (its ability to just outright get outpistoled) or the fact that players with fast reaction times will Thrust and throw off the tracking to ensure you can't get the kill. The weapon is great for flanking, as you can win if you get first shot (similar to the other tracking auto, the Needler), but in terms of straight up combat as an auto, the Suppressor is lacking.

      2. I'd like to see a buff to start-up RoF, but reduction to its RoF acceleration.

    5. Needler

      1. Like the Suppressor, a single Thrust or a good strafe can ruin your ability to win a battle with this weapon. Still an amazing flanker weapon. But the Needler still fills the niche it has always intended to do... I just want to recommend a completely separate change...

      2. When using the Melee with the Needler, make it discharge all remaining needles in a clip in a uniform cone, similar to the Shotgun. If the required number of needles land in a target for Supercombine, then BOOM, bye-bye close range target. (If too late for this on the regular Needler, this would be a great Warzone variant...)

  2. Precision Tweaks

    1. Pistol

      1. Many people are begging for the Pistol to become a 4-shot. I disagree. I'd just like the RoF to be slightly increased to better reward players with steady aim fighting in close quarters vs automatics (over those who carefully pace their shots at longer ranges). The Pistol feels like a skillful weapon to use, and still dominates the top level...but can't reliably fight automatics in close quarters.

      2. I'd like to see the Pistol's reload speed slightly increased as well, to help a Pistol-wielder get back into combat faster. (Sidearms should be able to be reloaded quickly.)

    2. BR

      1. I wouldn't change a thing, even with the Pistol buffed above. When fighting vs Autos, the BR/DMR hold up better than Pistol simply because of their ability to 2shot+beatdown (vs Pistol 3).

    3. DMR

      1. Same.

    4. Carbine

      1. I've noticed often at the pro level, pros will often pass up picking up the Carbine, whereas they'll almost never leave the BR or DMR. I don't know if the Carbine kills slower than the Pistol, but it isn't made clear with the Carbine that its range is superior to all but the DMR (even over the BR), leading a lot of players to pass it up.

    5. Light Rifle

      1. The only other weapon I've seen pros pass up, but I think it's a “feel” thing moreso than an actual power perception bit. The reticule doesn't look as comfortable as the Pistol's, making the LR “feel” more unwieldy.

  3. Other Weapon Tweaks

    1. Fuel Rod

      1. Needs to be either reduced to 2 Clips, rather than 3 OR put on a 3-minute timer. As it stands, there is just too much ammo for a one-hit kill potential weapon (granted it is usually 2 hits to kill) that essentially functions as a higher ROF Rocket Launcher.

      2. Maybe increase the effects of gravity on it or slow its projectile speed as well.

    2. Boltshot

      1. This weapon feels outshined by the automatics, so either its ROF needs to be increased, or its damage/tracking need to be improved. One potential change is to make it so each individual shot does more damage, but two of the three have weaker tracking – making it so if you do catch players off guard with it, the kill is almost ensured, but if they are actively strafing, they can avoid 1/3 or 2/3s of the damage and outplay you.

      2. The Smart Scope variant of the Boltshot makes it feel even more unwieldy, despite increasing the range of the tracking. This is just a feel issue.

    3. Rockets

      1. These seem to come up way too often on most maps. Granted there are only 4 shots and generally speaking, they're placed in an exposed area that forces a player to use some of the ammo immediately, but the prevalence of Rockets in many games is somewhat disconcerting due to the lower level of skill required to use them.

    4. Sniper

      1. Except for on Eden TS, where the weapon is absolutely dominant, the Sniper feels like it isn't up enough. 3 minutes is too long of a respawn timer for the Sniper.

      2. The reticule for the Sniper is too sticky, please reduce.

    5. Energy Sword

      1. Please don't change anything.

    6. Plasma Caster

      1. This weapon is...weird. It's great when you view it as “Oh, I now have 15 grenades.” but the charged clusterbomb version of use is used much, much more seldomly. You'll occasionally see it in standoffs on Rig TS, but rarely in other gametypes. (Granted, since Empire TS/CTF were removed, we only ever see PC on Truth...where it is almost never used.

      2. It FEELS like the Plasma Caster deals less damage or is less deadly with the charged shot, except when it sticks to a target. Perhaps giving the Plasma Caster's charged variant some degree of tracking a la the Plasma Launcher / a Plasma Pistol (if it doesn't already have it, doesn't feel like it does) would increase its potency with the charged variation.

      3. The weapon feels like it has a dead zone in close quarters, due to the incredible difficulty of hitting a close range shot.

    7. Hydra Launcher

      1. This weapon is under-utilized by many players, but I really like it. Much like the PC above, it's a weapon with two general use-cases... close range ground-spam to try to save yourself from being rushed... Or to get a pickoff with the slower method of firing (lock on).

      2. I think one of the weapon's biggest problems is really highlighted on Eden TS, and that's the range at which it can achieve a lock-on. It's too short range to really be used the way it seems to be intended on the map, and given the ability to counterplay it with Thrust, I don't see why it is so limited in range.

    8. Scattershot

      1. I love everything about the Scattershot except that bounced shots deal less damage. They already have a range penalty by being bounced, it shouldn't reduce the damage, regardless of the fact that the shots begin to track after bouncing.

    9. Shotgun

      1. Feels like a Shotgun should. Range feels just about perfect, and the weapon isn't prevalent on maps.

      2. Only complaint is comparing Shotgun vs Scattershot in terms of Ammo – the Shotgun is only ever given one clip. (Why are UNSC power weapons like Shotty/Rockets given less ammo than other factions?)

    10. SAW

      1. I know this isn't in Arena, but Warzone highlights how weak the SAW actually is – it loses to the SMG in close ranges, and doesn't have a powerful enough scope to beat out precision weapons in longer ranges. If this weapon were actually placed on maps with SMGs in Arena, I would pass it up every time in lieu of using the SMG.

    11. Railgun

      1. Since the hitscan change, weapon is fine.

  4. Radar

    1. Needs to be removed/changed to avoid negatively impacting competitive play.

      1. It should either show everyone regardless of motion (Turn into actual Radar rather than being a Motion Tracker) – but pulse every few seconds...or...

      2. Only reveal players who have been detected/spotted by other means (whether making noise by shooting orthrusting, taking damage from you or allies, etc.)

    2. If it's insisted upon that Radar stays at it is, change the Grenades to improve counterplay vs crouching radar plays. For example...

      1. Frags – Tune them more toward their Halo 2 variants where they left a large cloud of smoke, allowing a player who frags a corner the opportunity to push behind their Frag unseen.

      2. Plasmas – Turn up the visual distortion they already have and make them into effective Flashbangs for players caught too near to them.

      3. Splinters – Allow them to also send out a radar pulse as they detonate, revealing crouching/immobile players on motion tracker if they are near the Splinter grenade when it goes off.

  5. Maps

    1. Empire

      1. The Overshield in its current location is too much of a toss-up, while Tower is given its strongest defensive option in a location from which you don't really need to extract it.

      2. 2 Storm Rifles and 2 SMGs turn this map into a mess when trying to push outside or fight around Pit.

      3. Bring back Empire TS, please.

    2. Eden

      1. Eden SH is beautiful, but Blue side are essentially neutered off their initial spawn, as they have a toss-up to get Camo, and cannot contest Overshield. They have no power weapons of their own, save for the Plasma Pistol to try to belatedly burn the Red-side OS. Empire SH is very much a rotational gametype and shows teams with the best communication generally win it reliably.

      2. Eden TS, on the other hand...is a mess. The gametype is entirely dependent upon who gets the first set-up with Sniper, at which point if the team has both tower and Blue base, they essentially win the game outright, as players trapped in Red/outside have no means by which to reliably contest a Sniper.

      3. The BR outside red base should be replaced by a DMR – this would at least give a weapon with enough range to ping a Blue Plat-sitting Sniper out of scope for teams to be able to attempt to make a play.

      4. If Hydra had more range for lock-ons, being trapped in Red would be much less of a problem.

      5. Another option for improving Eden TS for teams without a lead would be to put a Camo somewhere on the Red side of the map to allow them to attempt to make plays against the Sniper-wielding opponents.

    3. Coliseum

      1. I have no real complaints about this map's set-up currently, other than already mentioned Rocket/Sniper timings.

    4. Plaza

      1. In TS, the way the map is laid out causes some extreme snowballing in the case that a team with Nest control gets an Overshield...as they get both Sniper+OS to play with. If a well-organized team gets first Sniper+full OS, the game is essentially over right there.

      2. Plasma Pistol should be moved to an area where it can be more reliably picked up by a team trying to fight off their spawns / contest the OS player, instead of being in Dip where it cannot be accessed by a team being spawn trapped.

      3. The SMGs in Yard and Tram are great for helping a team push out, but feel too close together. Perhaps swap the Tram SMG with the Plasma Pistol?

      4. SH on this gametype feels perfect, but the Shotgun is in an awkward location where MANY, MANY players either don't know it exists, or forget it is there and pass it up very often. It may be worth moving the weapon out of the pod in order to emphasize its existence.

      5. If geometry changes are on the menu, the Dip/PP->Top Yellow tactical jump could be cleaned up a bit to make it more fluid. Many people know the jump, but it's very easy to fall off from the second of the three jumps.

    5. Truth

      1. Plasma Caster is almost never used on this map, because of how the geometry handles bouncing the grenades, as well as the heavily exposed spawn location and the general open nature of the map making it hard to try to bounce it around corners for pickoffs. Some other kind of weapon would be much better to put in its place, if a power weapon top middle is even necessary.

      2. Carbines and Battle Rifles are dominant on the map due to the extremely long sightlines and their superior red reticule range over the pistol. Swapping the spawn point of the BR and SMG could alleviate some of this dominance by forcing players anchoring window to temporarily leave the window in order to restock their ammo.

      3. Pink-side spawns seem like they don't exist. I know they are there, and on the map, but they don't seem to happen.

    6. Regret

      1. Fuel Rod should spawn on a 3 minute timer on this gametype to reduce the snowball effect of having Fuel Rod -and- Overshield at the same time. By staggering the two, it reduces the enormous swinginess of the gametype when one good play gets made at the perfect right time, and encourages teams to make more good plays without the crutch of the 15 ammo rocket launcher.

      2. Plasma Pistol is in a beautiful location and has caused an evolution of some teams completely foregoing first overshield in lieu of grabbing it and forcing a burn. Great metagame placement.

      3. The Storm Rifles should be moved into the bases, rather than on the ramp up to Carbine. As they are, players attempting to push off a base spawn to Carbine cannot grab them before potentially being engaged in combat, meaning players already at Carbine are at a huge advantage in defending their turf.

    7. The Rig

      1. Strongholds on this map plays a bit too formulaic due to how heavily the map relies on its choke points. Unlike other Strongholds' gametypes, you seldom see anyone attempt a 3-Cap at all (though they may try to hold one if it gets gifted to them).

      2. Giving some additional incentive for pushing to Engine or BR base could alleviate some of this stale gameplay, whether it's by moving the Scattershot to the SMG spawn from Basement, or introducing a second power weapon spawning in the area.

      3. Slayer's okay once you accept the design + existence of Sniper will guarantee stalemates.

    8. Fathom

      1. This map's essentially fine as-is, but the quickjump to top middle really should be made more reliable. It shouldn't be a skill jump especially given the ENORMOUS prevalence of its usage, and the fact that missing it just slightly means death or a forced burn of your Thrust.

      2. I'd like to see Plasma Grenades spawning somewhere other than in the Treehouse, though, to encourage other angles' Combat Evolved medal grabs for the Railgun.

    9. Torque

      1. Why are there 2 Hammers?

      2. There shouldn't be 2 Hammers.

      3. 4 Plasma Grenades bottom middle is too many.

      4. Spawns feel too far away from the base.

    10. Overgrowth

      1. The non-Camo corner Stronghold needs something near it to increase its value. As it stands, Pit+Camo corner are too close together to really encourage using anything else.

      2. BR corner of the map spawns seems too prevalent.

    11. Riptide

      1. Fuel Rod and SPNKR should have their gametypes swapped. Fuel Rod is better on gametypes where there is an Overshield (SH), since the extra clip of ammo helps burn the OS without losing your power weapon. SPNKR is better for just killin' folk.

      2. Suppressor should be replaced with a Needler for this map.

      3. This map and Overgrowth would be a lot better if we had King of the Hill or Extraction to play on them.

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why are there barrels on each corner of torque? like who made this decision? like wtf man. Also when they update the playlist i get the new map 90%  of the time. i get its new but dont force feed me.

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