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Halo 5: Guardians Arena Gameplay Settings Thread

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It's the argument between forcing movement or providing a power buff to locations.

 

First off, the breakout would usually give 1 BR to each team because you can get to your own treehouse faster than the other team can (plus, there are faster routes to Camo off the beginning of the game than going all the way to Treehouse). Moving the Garage weapon to Treehouse removes an "upgrade" weapon from the team bases, and because it is currently in a very accessible location it doesn't provide much depth to gameplay. I like the treehouse location for a couple reasons.

  • It's secluded and pretty far away from direct-Top Mid. Fathom is super fast paced, so I don't think we'd frequently see people leave Top Mid during a round of slaying just to go all the way into Treehouse for the BR.
  • It provides a clean option-select for players. I'm a big fan of nonlinear choices for players to make when obtaining a weapon. So not only would you have to contest and fight over the Treehouse for BR control in the first place, but you'd also get the options of bringing it towards Vat/Street, lay damage on Top Mid, or cycle back to your own Garage.

And as I mentioned, I think Brute Plasma Rifles would be appropriate to replace the Storm on the Subs.

Brute plasmas would be better. Anything to replace the 2 storms lol. And i dont think people would cycle back and forth from mid to tree just to keep BR much, i was just referencing the game start.

 

I think this map and Empire are the best example of "less is more" in this game. 1 pw, 1 pu, a couple tier 1 pickups and be done with it imo

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I completely disagree that weapons like BRs should be placed in power positions. That encourages sitting P3/Face with a BR and watching the front of the base your team is collapsing on while your other teammate sits in that same bubble with a Carbine and goes on sprees. Movement of the BR out of the base is a bigger contributor to the added snowballing on Truth than the Fuel Rod. Back in my forge days that's where we would place a Carbine as sort of a "Use this until you can find some BR ammo" weapon. But I can't think of anything in the H5 sandbox that could be used that way (maybe just place a magnum there).

 

On Plaza: I think moving the BR from Hotel to top blue ramp would make that spawn trap exponentially less punishing. Against good teams going down blue ramp from that spawn is a death sentence, so you're forced to push Yard at both a weapon disadvantage and a positional disadvantage.

I agree, I think Truth Slayer has been completely ruined since Worlds, with the BR and Carbine being in the towers. It makes it so much harder to push either tower when you will almost certainly be fighting a better gun as you approach.  Moving them back to the window or "Eli" of the bases would be better in my opinion.

 

And I agree with you with moving the BR from Hotel to top blue rap on Plaza as well. That is the death spawn for sure. (I'll never forget some player on Dynasty at Las vegas blaining us with sniper as soon as we spawned there).  Moving a BR there will help descoping a sniper at nest, as well as moving some of the spawn points a little more into Cafe would improve that spawn a ton. In general though I think Plaza is one of the best Slayer maps.

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Thoughts on Regret with the the only power items being Plasma Pistol, OS, and Scattershot?

 

I am not the biggest fan of this map to begin with, but never liked Caster or Scatter on it.  Removing Caster is a must imo. Scatter is negotiable w/ reduced ammo

 

Remove splinters/replace with stickies

Remove caster

one rifle per side

OS only

reduce scatter ammo

 

That's a hard map for me to judge because i really dislike the board in total.

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Thoughts on Regret with the the only power items being Plasma Pistol, OS, and Scattershot?

 

Would you move Plasma Pistol to P2? I think you definitely need something on P2 to make sure teams that neglect that side of the map aren't rewarded for it. But I agree that Caster/Scatter/OS is too much, and I'd prefer removing Caster.

 

Also, I'll reiterate that I'd like to see 30 or 60 second timers for tier 2 weapons and grenades. 60 for Scatter/Shotty/Splinter (Maybe GL depending on how useful it ends up being) and 30 for Hydra/Frags/Plasmas.

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Would you move Plasma Pistol to P2? I think you definitely need something on P2 to make sure teams that neglect that side of the map aren't rewarded for it. But I agree that Caster/Scatter/OS is too much, and I'd prefer removing Caster.

 

Also, I'll reiterate that I'd like to see 30 or 60 second timers for tier 2 weapons and grenades. 60 for Scatter/Shotty/Splinter (Maybe GL depending on how useful it ends up being) and 30 for Hydra/Frags/Plasmas.

 

 

Scattershot P2 and Plasma Pistol in Tunnel would be pretty interesting IMO. I also don't think we need the Storm Rifle on Regret but if it stayed at P1 I wouldn't riot.

 

I've never really minded Tier 2 weapons having fast respawns. Having a weapon that is constantly in play is an interesting dynamic to play with, but I could understand why people are frustrated with how fast they can be farmed.

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Scattershot P2 and Plasma Pistol in Tunnel would be pretty interesting IMO. I also don't think we need the Storm Rifle on Regret but if it stayed at P1 I wouldn't riot.

 

I've never really minded Tier 2 weapons having fast respawns. Having a weapon that is constantly in play is an interesting dynamic to play with, but I could understand why people are frustrated with how fast they can be farmed.

 

As long as they are actually treated like a Tier 2 (only one on the map at a time) then i dont have a problem with a quick respawn either. 30 seconds is probably the sweet spot imo, but 15 seconds is fine since there would only be one on the map at a time no matter what.  

 

SRs are just so easy to get right now. Back when there were still 2 storm rifles on Empire we would hold up outside for about a minute and all 4 players could have SRs.  it was nuts.

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Scattershot P2 and Plasma Pistol in Tunnel would be pretty interesting IMO. I also don't think we need the Storm Rifle on Regret but if it stayed at P1 I wouldn't riot.

I've never really minded Tier 2 weapons having fast respawns. Having a weapon that is constantly in play is an interesting dynamic to play with, but I could understand why people are frustrated with how fast they can be farmed.

 

Regret was another great success in the "Place storm like a minor power weapon" experiment we had going in a lot of the season 2 maps. Wouldn't have a problem if it stayed either.

 

Fast spawns on T2 weapons are only a problem because of the weapons that have them, IMO (perhaps also because they still de-spawn fairly fast). 1 clip Shotguns are the most glaring one, as I feel like the "always on the map" effect associated with dynamic weapon spawns is dramatically more interesting with weapons that stay on the map for a long time, but aren't "Control this and you win" weapons either. A good example of this is the sword in H2. Was similar in effectiveness with many of our current T2 weapons, but it essentially stayed on the map forever. Made for a perfect nuetral power weapon for arena-style slayer maps. That's actually a big reason why I'd like to see Scatter stay on Regret as the only power weapon instead of PC.

 

As long as they are actually treated like a Tier 2 (only one on the map at a time) then i dont have a problem with a quick respawn either. 30 seconds is probably the sweet spot imo, but 15 seconds is fine since there would only be one on the map at a time no matter what.  

 

SRs are just so easy to get right now. Back when there were still 2 storm rifles on Empire we would hold up outside for about a minute and all 4 players could have SRs.  it was nuts.

 

Yeah, Eden TS's slow nature is in large part to having 2 T2 weapons IMO. As the down team, even if you manage to gain control of Tower there's a good chance the other team still has Shotgun, and if you fail a push you risk losing the Hydra as well. All of a sudden the other team has map control and a power weapon in the hands of every player.

 

Storm Rifles never belonged on Empire in the first place, and the fact that there were 2, in close proximity to each other, and in a position that teams already favored made it a recipe for disaster. We've come a long way with Storm rifle placement in the most recent iteration of the settings (and with using BPR instead when necessary) and I can't say I'd advocate for Storm rifles to be removed on any of the current maps. But it's a Tier 1.5 weapon in my mind and I'd like to see it treated differently than rifles.

 

Perhaps this is a more reasonable approach to T2 timers?

 

  • 60 seconds: Splinter Nades
  • 30 seconds: Shotty, Scatter, Plasmas, Frags
  • 15 seconds: Hydra, Storm, SMG, BPR
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Thoughts on Regret with the the only power items being Plasma Pistol, OS, and Scattershot?

 

Do you even need power weapons/power ups? I think we need to have a lockdown-esqe game type thats all about pistol skill with no power ups and i feel like regret and truth ts are small enough maps to get away with having no power weapons/ups

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Perhaps this is a more reasonable approach to T2 timers?

 

  • 60 seconds: Splinter Nades
  • 30 seconds: Shotty, Scatter, Plasmas, Frags
  • 15 seconds: Hydra, Storm, SMG, BPR

 

 

As a thought experiment, i like that.  i think i would move the SR to the 30 second range, but otherwise i agree.

 

The problem I have is that as much as I do not believe that the competitive settings needs to mirror vanilla, i do think that they should still be simple so having 3 different timers like that looks too complicated.  I would put everything on the same timer, probably 30, 45 or 60 seconds.  We have enough experience with the 15 second timer at this point that i think its too fast.

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Do you even need power weapons/power ups? I think we need to have a lockdown-esqe game type thats all about pistol skill with no power ups and i feel like regret and truth ts are small enough maps to get away with having no power weapons/ups

I disagree.

 

H5 suffers from having too many low tier weapons, but I think at least one tier 3 weapon or powerup per map is a must as a movement incentive.

 

I am not against the suggestion of only having camo and os on a map (was that suggested for empire earlier?), But in general I think removing true power weapons is a mistake.

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I disagree.

 

H5 suffers from having too many low tier weapons, but I think at least one tier 3 weapon or powerup per map is a must as a movement incentive.

 

I am not against the suggestion of only having camo and os on a map (was that suggested for empire earlier?), But in general I think removing true power weapons is a mistake.

 

It's definitely something that needs testing. some of these maps, truth especially, suffer from too many weapons. truth does not need 5 different weapons. If there is any currnt map and type that could go down to just pistols and maybe dmr or br its truth slayer

 

empire can have snipe and rocks since its a large open map, but  it doesnt need smgs and brute pistols and a shotgun as well.

 

hopefully this upcoming update will look at weapon placements. the map can get pretty congested at times and we already know how overpowering they can be

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Thoughts on Regret with the the only power items being Plasma Pistol, OS, and Scattershot?

I don't really like the scatter shot on that map. I don't know if I hate it because it's a scatter or just because it's yet another power weapon on a map. I don't think the scatter is too bad on Regret simply because of who the angles of the map works (I agree with Snip3down's video). 

 

It would be interesting that it would only have OS though. 

 

I think either Regret and or Empire should become power up only maps due to there size, and I wouldn't mind Truth only having Sword and camo.

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It's definitely something that needs testing. some of these maps, truth especially, suffer from too many weapons. truth does not need 5 different weapons. If there is any currnt map and type that could go down to just pistols and maybe dmr or br its truth slayer

 

empire can have snipe and rocks since its a large open map, but  it doesnt need smgs and brute pistols and a shotgun as well.

 

hopefully this upcoming update will look at weapon placements. the map can get pretty congested at times and we already know how overpowering they can be

On Truth specifically, there are certainly weapons we don't need. The rifles need work if they are going to stay at all. The Hydra can go, and the Fuel must go.

 

But I'd leave Camo where it is a move the Sword top mid. IMHO, P1 is a location that begs for a powerup and I see no reason to change it. I guess a case could be made to replace it with a Storm Rifle or Scattershot or something to counterbalance the sword up top, but I think something should be there.

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Also, on the topic of Splinters, what are your thoughts on making them full fledged power weapons? For example the caster on Rig was replaced with two splinters with a 90 second respawn. Alternatively, use them in place of autos: Replace FR on Truth with Sword, and each of the Storm Rifles is replace with one Splinter with a 60 second respawn after being thrown. Thoughts?

 

pulled you into the game settings thread.

 

The problem with splinters as power weapons is that grenades in Halo tend to be more "reactive" than "proactive".  They are something that you carry with you while you execute your plan.  They don't change what your plan is like rockets or sniper do compared to if you didn't have them.  Splinters can get you easy kills, but generally they come from very reactive "oh shit!!" moments, rather than purposeful, planned moments.

What grenades you are holding are also not apparent to your opponent either, so they can't react to you based on what cards you are showing.

 

I do believe that for Splinters to fill their AOD niche correctly, they need to be totally reworked.

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If splinters had a 1 second detonation delay, they would be infinitely more tolerable, and dare I say, fun.

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If splinters had a 1 second detonation delay, they would be infinitely more tolerable, and dare I say, fun.

 

Literally this.

 

pulled you into the game settings thread.

 

 

22448_thank-you-zach-galifianakis.gif

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I think we're on the same page.

 

What I'd really like to see is the Recon DMR just be the utility weapon in Halo going forward. It's got the right look, right zoom range, it's single shot, and its a rifle so it's more likely to be taken seriously as the main weapon in the game than a pistol is. I'd reduce the magnetism on it for sure, make it a 4sk, reduce its RoF a bit, and most importantly, make it projectile.

 

-After that, I'd get rid of the regular DMR entirely, as it's just redundant.

 

-Then I'd let the Light Rifle zoom in a bit further but otherwise leave it unchanged. It's a great addition to the sandbox and fills a unique role.

 

-I might keep the BR, but it would have some serious changes. I'd try to make it that mid-close beast, but make it a lot harder to control. It would have significant recoil with each successive bullet in the burst, with a perfectly straight vertical spread. It would also be projectile. But to balance out the new difficulty of use (particularly at range), I'd make it hit pretty hard. 4sk with a faster RoF and faster perfect kill time than the DMR. Give this weapon some character and make it feel, perform, and excel differently than the DMR.

 

-So now this new BR role steps on the toes of the Carbine. As I've said before in other posts on this matter, I think the Carbine has always been redundant and lacked a unique purpose. It's always been an also-ran that no one really goes out of their way for. I think we should make this weapon a niche weapon. Keep everything about it the same, except make it take several more shots to kill, like an 11 shot, but allow each shot hit to do corrosive, lingering damage over time to a player, with each shot "burning" for maybe .25 seconds. So lets say I see a guy I can't finish. If I can land 5 Carbine shots, I can keep his shields receiving damage for over a full second after I've stopped hitting him, plus the time it takes for the shield to recharge normally. This keeps him out of the fight and unable to watch his lane much longer than any other type of damage you can deal to him. He also wouldn't be able to zoom in. Currently no weapon performs this role, and I think it would be extremely valuable for pushing "dug in" enemies and breaking setups.

 

-Lastly, the pistol. Since it's been replaced with the Recon DMR as our utility weapon, I think we need to find a different role for it. I really think 343 is on to something with the Gunfighter Magnum. That should be our pistol. Give it a super quick swap time, super quick rate of fire, make it like a 6 shot kill (2 perfect kills to a clip), and give it a little faster killtime than the AR and the DMR, just quite a bit tougher to use. It should be the preferred secondary for someone with really good aim. Don't give it a scope.

 

The whole goal with this precision weapon sandbox is to give each weapon a unique role, and a specific reason to want to pick it up. In our current sandbox, the BR, DMR and Carbine are all more or less interchangeable, and that seems like wasted potential to me.

 

@@Deez, I'd love to hear your thoughts on this.

I could get behind something like this.

 

Although, if the difficulty of the precision weapons is increased as much as you make it sound like, I would definitely prefer that the perfect killtimes be sped up more akin to HCE instead of the teamshot heavy H3 that this sounds like.

 

But the average killtime should definitely be noticeably slower than the perfect killtime I agree.

 

I'm thinking like don't nerf the 4sk DMR fire rate, and make that difficult to control BR a 3sk (BTW the H5 BR already has perfectly vertical recoil spread).

 

The Gunfighter Magnum is already a 6sk, I think that it should at least be a 5sk or even a faster firing DMR 4sk(kinda like Reach and the H5 beta with them both being 5sk) if it is also difficult to control via perfectly vertical recoil as well.

 

I do think that the Magnum could serve a niche as an extra lethal CQC-limited precision weapon though. The Gunfighter almost nails it.

 

BTW, the Carbine would also have to be battery powered to differentiate itself further. However, in regards to the 'burn' mechanic, look up the Thorn History from Destiny. Beware, that gun got A LOT of hate.

 

Edit: what's funny is that that most of what I mentioned is already somewhat possible with Evolved settings...

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I would be interested in seeing a no rifle, except maybe the light rifle, sandbox be tested. Keep all the redundant rifles for warzone and big team. 4 shot pistol would be cool to see tested also but chances are even it getting tested are very slim. 

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I would be interested in seeing a no rifle, except maybe the light rifle, sandbox be tested. Keep all the redundant rifles for warzone and big team. 4 shot pistol would be cool to see tested also but chances are even it getting tested are very slim.

Preach

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