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Halo 5: Guardians Arena Gameplay Settings Thread

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What does everyone think about the power weapon changes on Riptide (Hydra where Fuel Rod spawned) and Overgrowth (Needler instead of Sword)?

 

Do these changes make the maps more competitive and balanced? And most importantly, not completely infuriating to play?

 

Yes, I'll no longer be dashboarding Riptide. It's so much more playable now. I still don't find it fun but it's no longer infuriating as you said.

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Gotcha fam.

 

Dynamic Powerup timers allow varied gameplay throughout the match, rather than having the exact same weapon cycle occur 4 times in a row. This is essentially the reason Sniper and Rockets varied the way they are. One minute with Rocks, one with Snipe, then one with both of them up at the same time.

 

To put it into perspective the best I'll use MOBA analogies. Let's say we are on Eden Strongholds.

 

Early Game: Rockets and Powerups Spawn at 12:00, after the second cycle, Rockets will still be up and OS/Camo are relatively predictable because they only show up a few seconds after the Static. Easily predictable even for the team that didn't grab them.

 

Mid Game: Rockets spawn at 8:00, but Powerups are slowly becoming more delayed (even more so by the second cycle). This means that the focus at the start of the cycle is primarily on Rockets, whereas at the beginning of the game, people had their attention on three different items. Now everyone is looking at Rockets. Mid-game is also when players are rewarded for recording times.

 

Late Game: The end of match is already hectic in and of itself, and the weapon cycles reward players who can maintain composure. Players are rewarded for remembering their times, etc. In addition, Rockets and Powerups are now very separated. They could even be spawning an entire minute apart, which is much more different than the beginning of the game.

 

 

If everything is Static, then you are just playing the same game every 2 minutes – back to back to back to back. Dynamic Powerups allow a certain level of predictability while artificially shifting the meta game and how players place resources and dictate map flow.

Three problems with this

 

A] the skill (or in my opinion, the lack thereof) required in dynamic spawns

 

B] the uniformness of the spawn system

 

C] making the match dynamic

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First off, dynamic spawns are not skillful. Not to the extent of static, anyway. They work in games like Quake where the meta is 1v1 fo used and there are numerous pickups on the map. If Quake was static, there'd be too many uncontested items at any given time. In a team game like Halo, with regenerating health and faster kill times (or used to, anyway), this does not apply.

 

I argue that the skill required to fight for weapons and powerups everyone has an opportunity to and can predict at any given time is far more skillful than timing a powerup and getting it without a fight. You have to figure out how to outplay your opponents and EARN that powerup.

 

Static spawns also force the action to locations. This means people will be moving, and, as competitive play usually demands, being aggressive. This is ideal in an FPS. Playing a campy game and watching it are both shitty experiences

 

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Secondly, there is a problem in the casual or newcomer scene when it comes to having dynamic and static spawns. Much like making our competitive settings as close to casual settings to promote inclusivity and uniformity, one spawn system can help newer players understand the game and the way systems work. Not only are static timers more skillful, they are easier to understand and be played with by newcomers, which is especially important considering what Halo has gone through in the last 5 years.

 

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Lastly, I take issue with how dynamic spawns offer a more "dynamic" (hah get it) experience. Halo is unique because encounters can have VASTLY different outcomes due to one single choice. I argue static spawns encourage MORE dynamic experiences because the fight to obtain them can go anyway. Sometimes, the fight may not even be to get them, but to prevent the enemy from getting them. Or you could bait the other team, and assassinate them while their back's turned. There are MANY different outcomes that result in static spawns; to say you play the "same game" every 2 minutes is very disingenuous, personally. On top of that, don't we want sameness i the game? Predictabilty is important in a competitive shooter. Predictability is what enables high level strategies and outplays. If anything, we need MORE of it, considering Halo 5's multiple entrance map design and manipulatable powerup spawns.

 

TL;DR Static spawns encourage aggression, strategy, and prediction, three major components of ANY competitive title.

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TL;DR Static spawns encourage aggression, strategy, and prediction, three major components of ANY competitive title.

 

 

I agree with all your points but uniformity can lead to unnecessary repetitiveness. In the grand scheme of a single game of Halo, if every single item was static then you are just going to have the same 2-minute cycles played out over and over. Can people change the tides in those cycles? Of course. But it doesn't make the game any more interesting. Halo already has a very linear competitive nature with fair starts, we need some sort of diversity to shake up the meta game.

 

(This is essentially the same argument for rotating Assault Bomb spawns.)un

 

Tier 3 Weapons allow guaranteed consistency and setups

Dynamic Powerups allow shifting gameplay pace/flow and make every match play differently.

 

The two can coexist.

 

P.S. As a random thought I'd like to see something played with in the future regarding Static Powerups. Perhaps there could be a map that has a Static OS and a Dynamic Camo. Would make things very interesting.

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Why does it seem like nobody cares about the lack of an HCS playlist? Team Arena just gets random gametypes and maps thrown into it each month and the playlist gets worse and worse. I honestly don't even want to try when riptide, torque, or overgrowth come up.

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Why does it seem like nobody cares about the lack of an HCS playlist? Team Arena just gets random gametypes and maps thrown into it each month and the playlist gets worse and worse. I honestly don't even want to try when riptide, torque, or overgrowth come up.

Bravo basically confirmed that Torque will be used in the pro league, so you might as well get used to it being around. I do agree with riptide and overgrowth though, idk why those are still included. 

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I agree with all your points but uniformity can lead to unnecessary repetitiveness. In the grand scheme of a single game of Halo, if every single item was static then you are just going to have the same 2-minute cycles played out over and over. Can people change the tides in those cycles? Of course. But it doesn't make the game any more interesting. Halo already has a very linear competitive nature with fair starts, we need some sort of diversity to shake up the meta game.

 

(This is essentially the same argument for rotating Assault Bomb spawns.)un

 

Tier 3 Weapons allow guaranteed consistency and setups

Dynamic Powerups allow shifting gameplay pace/flow and make every match play differently.

 

The two can coexist.

 

P.S. As a random thought I'd like to see something played with in the future regarding Static Powerups. Perhaps there could be a map that has a Static OS and a Dynamic Camo. Would make things very interesting.

You can make game play feel more varied and less linear with static timers by staggering the time intervals for the items. For an example on a forge map you can put camo on a 60 second static timer, OS on a 90 second static timer, rockets on a 2 min static timer, and the sniper on a 3 min static timer. Watch this video to get a better understanding of what I mean by staggering the time intervals for power items on the map. https://youtu.be/UFFwsyqAofQ?t=4m58s

 

With static timers you can make the game play feel more varied while maintaining a consistent and predictable flow of power item cycling. Dynamic timers might seem more interesting because they make things seem less repetitive but the downside to them is that they make the flow of the items less predictable and inconsistent thus making the game play feel more random and chaotic.

 

The issue with having static timers and dynamic timers coexisting together in a Halo game is that the philosophies behind them contradict each other. Having both styles of timers for power items just overcomplicates the game especially for newcomers. IMO we should be striving for predictability, consistency, and clarity not for randomness, inconsistency, and confusion. Having power-ups and power weapons both be on static timers is the best way to go IMO.

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Okay, they just added a Warzone variant of the magnum that gives it extended mags (18 shots I think). I think that until they do actual sandbox changes that they should add this instead of the default magnum. The clip size of the magnum is one of my biggest complaints about the weapon.

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What do you guys think of putting a sniper in each cave on Coliseum? Except drop the clip so it only has 8 shots in it overall.

 

This is one of the only halo games where a sniper standoff isn't a thing and I know people love that stuff. 

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What do you guys think of putting a sniper in each cave on Coliseum? Except drop the clip so it only has 8 shots in it overall.

 

This is one of the only halo games where a sniper standoff isn't a thing and I know people love that stuff. 

So do you make it a Tier 2 weapon at that point? It still isn't possible to modify ammo on weapon pads.

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Torque could use a sniper as well. Bravo mentioned in the stream that they will work with pros to find the ideal weapon layout for competitive play on torque. 

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So do you make it a Tier 2 weapon at that point? It still isn't possible to modify ammo on weapon pads.

Personally I wouldn't mind if sniper was removed from the weapon pads, but since they've been on them the whole time this far into the game, it'd feel weird taking them off. I didn't know the ammo on weapon pad weapons wasn't adjustable, so idk if it'd be better just to keep the weapons on the pads and have full clip snipes or to just have them placed off the pads with sightly less ammo. 

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Static spawns

 

 

Dynamic spawns

 

I see the costs and benefits of both. I would just like to add two things and see what you guys think. 

1.) All static spawns works great in CE. I realize they are not the same game, but I love having static spawns in CE and it never seems to get old or repetitive. It forces people to get very creative and constantly try new ways to secure the power-up/weapon because everyone always knows when it is coming. 

2.) Can't dynamic spawns promote snowballing? I feel like I see a decent amount of pro games where one team gets 5/6 over shields (or basically every camo on truth for instance) in a game because they got the first one and know the precise times throughout the game. It can feel like the other team almost has to get lucky to get them at certain points. 

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I disagree with dynamic timers for a few reasons. I love them in quake, but not in a team based shooter like Halo.

 

There's definitely a matter of preference involved.  I just don't value the ability to obtain/time items/weapons that have slowly drifted apart as requiring a higher skill than having static timers that force teams to make choose what they need or what is most important. I'd rather have static timers that are on intervals like how the weapons work. This forces a similar variety in gameplay without having this variable time drift.

 

I could go more in depth if I have to. I just don't think we should be striving for that beaver creek gameplay, we should be striving for that chill out gameplay

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 we should be striving for that chill out gameplay

 

Chill out was the first map I thought of when I was thinking about how great static spawns can play and the benefits they bring. 

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  • Remove Radar

Remove Assault Rifle from initial spawn

Remove all Storm Rifles/SMGs from the maps

Remove Sniper from Eden and Rig

Nerf spawn ammunition on Sniper to 8 rounds (If possible, if not add 30 seconds to spawn rotation)

Increase amount of ammunition an individual can carry for their pistol

Remove Spartan charge

Remove Grenade indicators

Better weighing of maps

Party restrictions

More balanced MMR's

Remove all Shotgun/Scatter Shot

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I love watching Halo 5 played competitively and love playing it. I think it's a great game and is not in desperate need of sandbox changes, but I do agree that there are some things that could be incremental improvements to the current gameplay. If they didn't happen though, it wouldn't be the end of Halo or anything.

 

My two cents on nice-to-have changes to an otherwise pretty strong competitive game (imo):

  • slight nerf to storm rifle so it matches SMG ttk
  • nerf to OP SMG/Storm respawn times
  • reduce amount of SMG/Storms on maps - there should never be more than two of these weapons on a map
  • slight nerf to AR ttk
  • increase current pistol clip size slightly
  • I think current pistol/BR/DMR balance is really good (I think 4sk pistol would be the most OP weapon in the game) provided the nerfs to autos described above, but wouldn't be opposed to a very slight increase in ROF. Just don't think there are any necessary changes here.
  • reduce Spartan Charge magnetism (you shouldn't be able to curve so significantly after your charge started)
  • This won't be popular, but since I'm among friends... I'm fine with radar. I think much more is made of it than necessary and it's not negatively impactful on gameplay. I wouldn't be opposed to changing it to highlight spartan ability usage and firing only, but I do believe it has a place in this game's competitive gameplay and certainly don't think we've observed it to be the ruination of Halo. If 343 ultimately decides for whatever reason that it must be removed, they should keep movement sounds in place, with a slight nerf to your footstep sounds when moving slowly (they might need to do that anyway... point being, you should be able to quiet-walk). That said, I don't understand the desire or reasoning for removing radar and movement sounds, so if someone can help me on that one it would be appreciated. 
  • Reduce the amount of time a splinter grenade stays open - not entirely sure what it is now, but I'm thinking it should be about half that... it's absurd that you can win a battle, turn around a second later and die even though your shields are coming back up
I like the changes they've made to Riptide and Overgrowth and they might yet have a place in competitive gameplay. It also might be fun to have two snipers on Coliseum with reduced clips.

 

And I know we're talking HCS settings, but damn it would be nice if those two maps didn't come up every other game in Team Arena, and I would love to play Plaza Strongholds/Slayer a lot more than currently.

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What do you guys think of putting a sniper in each cave on Coliseum? Except drop the clip so it only has 8 shots in it overall.

 

This is one of the only halo games where a sniper standoff isn't a thing and I know people love that stuff. 

 

 

This was tested in H5 development, they decided on one Sniper. Two would be way too bad for Slayer.

 

I would eventually like to see a two Sniper map (Torque for example) but to be honest I think the Sniper is just way too strong to warrant that.

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This was tested in H5 development, they decided on one Sniper. Two would be way too bad for Slayer.

 

I would eventually like to see a two Sniper map (Torque for example) but to be honest I think the Sniper is just way too strong to warrant that.

Two snipe map would suck unless we had the the sniper from CE or something approaching that. We need a non-game changer sniper if we want a map with two of them.
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Anyone think Shotgun and Camo should be switched on Plaza Strongholds? Seems like Camo is definitely the stronger item and the fact that Nest gets it for free is pretty crazy.

 

Camo in Yard would be a much more dynamic setup breaker IMO.

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Anyone think Shotgun and Camo should be switched on Plaza Strongholds? Seems like Camo is definitely the stronger item and the fact that Nest gets it for free is pretty crazy.

 

Camo in Yard would be a much more dynamic setup breaker IMO.

I'd like to see the OS in top mid and the rail gun in cafe maybe....I like Eden's multiple power ups and want to see more maps embrace that
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I'd also like to throw out that I think the Storm Rifle is perfectly acceptable in its current state but needs to be placed perfectly on a map in a less than favorable position.

 

Empire, Riptide, and Regret all have two Storm Rifles that lead right into Close Quarters areas. The quantity and situational use for them is just completely broken.

 

Rig and Plaza only have one Storm Rifle that requires you to drop bottom mid, completely sacrificing positional advantage to use it. I love it's niche on those maps.

 

On Empire, they should be removed. On Riptide, they should remove both and place one where Hydra used to be. On Regret, replace them with SMGs.

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I'd like to see the OS in top mid and the rail gun in cafe maybe....I like Eden's multiple power ups and want to see more maps embrace that

 

On Strongholds? Railgun is neutral, Camo favors Nest, and Shotgun favors Yard. I think the flow of that current setup is really good but is lopsided towards Nest because of Camo, when it is already a favorable position.

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On Strongholds? Railgun is neutral, Camo favors Nest, and Shotgun favors Yard. I think the flow of that current setup is really good but is lopsided towards Nest because of Camo, when it is already a favorable position.

Meh. The OS works top mid because you can't get melted after picking it up, which you can with railgun. Think OS would be better top mid personally

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