Jump to content
CyReN

Halo 5: Guardians Arena Gameplay Settings Thread

Recommended Posts

@@Sal1ent is there a process, official way or someone we need to consult like Ghostayame during H4 settings to make changes if majority want them?

 

Should we do a survey? What would be the best way bruh bruh?

I think the idea of having an official person to handle settings / polls / pro player outreach would be extremely beneficial.

 

The best person to do this (In my opinion) would be Ghost, because he literally did this during 95% of Halo 4, has good relationships with all the pros, etc.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

@@Sal1ent is there a process, official way or someone we need to consult like Ghostayame during H4 settings to make changes if majority want them?

 

Should we do a survey? What would be the best way bruh bruh?

 

 

We aren't the ones playing the settings. While community feedback did come into account, a lot of Ghost's tests were reliant on Forgers and Pros to critique maps and gametypes.

 

Can't rely on an echo chamber when pros may want something that is entirely different. Gotta have a middle ground.

 

Edit: As @@Saucey pretty much said, this job pretty much is already allocated to Pro Team. Them and the Arena design team definitely let the HCS Team know what the most competitive gametypes were in the pool.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

Remove radar.

Make gametypes all 15 minutes with overtime being sudden death

Change respawn times to 5 seconds in slayer 10 in obj.

Remove grenade hitmarkers.

Nerf automatics.

Buff pistol to 4 shot or change to Br starts.

I agree with all of that except for the last one.  nerf Auto's first, play with that for a while and see how it changes the sandbox because it will undoubtedly change things we don't expect, then revisit the pistol.  BR starts i think are a non-starter.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

I agree with all of that except for the last one.  nerf Auto's first, play with that for a while and see how it changes the sandbox because it will undoubtedly change things we don't expect, then revisit the pistol.  BR starts i think are a non-starter.

If you want to take things slow, I'd buff the pistol first and then scale the automatics accordingly, I said it earlier, I think nerfing the autos will create a giant backlash from the waypoint/reddit community.

I think a 4sk feels way more "natural" as well but thats probably just me...

  • Upvote (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

If you want to take things slow, I'd buff the pistol first and then scale the automatics accordingly, I said it earlier, I think nerfing the autos will create a giant backlash from the waypoint/reddit community.

I think a 4sk feels way more "natural" as well but thats probably just me...

Yeah, it probably would but i dont care about their opinions haha.

 

The problem with buffing the pistol is that sure you fix the problem with it being UP against Autos, but then you also make it pointless to every pick up a BR, LR, Carbine etc and fuck up the balance with those which even if we disagree on how balanced the pistol is against other precision weapons, i think we can agree that its more balanced against those auto's are against anything.

 

Since autos are the bigger problem, and changes always effect more things that we can predict, lets start with autos and go from there.  A 4sk pistol sounds good to me, but i dont think we should jump there right away is all.

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, it probably would but i dont care about their opinions haha.

 

The problem with buffing the pistol is that sure you fix the problem with it being UP against Autos, but then you also make it pointless to every pick up a BR, LR, Carbine etc and fuck up the balance with those which even if we disagree on how balanced the pistol is against other precision weapons, i think we can agree that its more balanced against those auto's are against anything.

 

Since autos are the bigger problem, and changes always effect more things that we can predict, lets start with autos and go from there. A 4sk pistol sounds good to me, but i dont think we should jump there right away is all.

I would rather have "useless" rifle pick ups instead of straight upgrades like we have now. Rifles have more RRR and magnetism. That's the advantage. They are easier.
  • Upvote (+1) 2

Share this post


Link to post

We aren't the ones playing the settings. While community feedback did come into account, a lot of Ghost's tests were reliant on Forgers and Pros to critique maps and gametypes.

 

Can't rely on an echo chamber when pros may want something that is entirely different. Gotta have a middle ground.

 

Edit: As @@Saucey pretty much said, this job pretty much is already allocated to Pro Team. Them and the Arena design team definitely let the HCS Team know what the most competitive gametypes were in the pool.

 

Like Breakout and relic?  :kappa:

 

I think Ghost had a thread on waypoint or beyond where the public could voice their opinion which he would read also if I remember correctly

Share this post


Link to post

I wonder if they would be up for adding 2 more shots to pistol clips.

The Warzone pistol variant would be better. Feels so good not reloading after every single kill.

Share this post


Link to post

I would rather have "useless" rifle pick ups instead of straight upgrades like we have now. Rifles have more RRR and magnetism. That's the advantage. They are easier.

That's a separate issue though.  If a gun is "Easy" to use, they can make it harder without changing the damage characteristics significantly, or at all.  You shouldn't be spawning with the best gun in the game.

  • Upvote (+1) 1
  • Downvote (-1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

Yeah, it probably would but i dont care about their opinions haha.

 

The problem with buffing the pistol is that sure you fix the problem with it being UP against Autos, but then you also make it pointless to every pick up a BR, LR, Carbine etc and fuck up the balance with those which even if we disagree on how balanced the pistol is against other precision weapons, i think we can agree that its more balanced against those auto's are against anything.

 

Since autos are the bigger problem, and changes always effect more things that we can predict, lets start with autos and go from there.  A 4sk pistol sounds good to me, but i dont think we should jump there right away is all.

Pick Ups will still be the easier and more safe version to use, CC is different from BR/DMR and offers a different feel.

Share this post


Link to post

 

The "delicacy" of the sandbox is grossly overstated in Halo. Who cares if a weapon becomes obsolete if you tune another to make the overall gameplay better? That only matters if there is a viable reason to have the weapon in the sandbox in the first place. Is there a rational gameplay-related reason to have the Pistol, the BR, the LR, and the DMR in Halo 5? I can't think of one. A stronger pistol with slightly better range would make those other weapons obsolete, and rightly so. They are redundancies that only serve to obfuscate the actual shooting skill that might be present (Did I lose that battle because I got out-shot, or because he had a BR and I had a pistol?).

 
You use CoD as an example, so I will do the same. In almost every single game, there are three or four "best" weapons that most players use. All of the other weapons in that sandbox are used casually or not at all. And that's okay. The mere inclusion of a weapon in a game does not warrant that it immediately demands refined balance against all the other weapons. Not only would that serve little purpose in the actual balance of the game, it's also practically impossible. 
 
The core gameplay and core weapons are all that matter. Shooting "meta" only matters in regards to unique niches overall, otherwise players simply gravitate towards the most effective weapon in each niche. Like CoD, adding or removing weapons to a weapon class doesn't change anything about the "meta" of the shooting, it just changes which weapon players use. There is a difference. There is no "meta" difference between the pistol, the BR, the LR, and the DMR. None whatsoever. Players grab the best available weapon, and that's rarely the spawning weapon.
 
That's the real issue. Halo, due to the way the core gameplay functions, is a game that must be balanced around a core utility weapon, not around a massive sandbox of weapons. Get the core right and everything else falls into place and/or becomes irrelevant. Halo 5 with a faster slaying, skill-based pistol would play much better than it does now even if that results in 80% of the weapons becoming useless. 

 

http://teambeyond.net/forum/topic/5443-halo-5-guardians-discussion/page-4199?do=findComment&comment=687667

Share this post


Link to post

Yes. Yes you should lmao.

lol no you shouldn't.  You should be spawning with a VERY good gun, but not the best one.  Let me clarify what "Best" means (to me).  Best means a gun that can beat any non-power weapon at any range.  Having this discussion considering the context of range is important.

Share this post


Link to post

lol no you shouldn't. You should be spawning with a VERY good gun, but not the best one. Let me clarify what "Best" means (to me). Best means a gun that can beat any non-power weapon at any range. Having this discussion considering the context of range is important.

Then how did you enjoy CE? H2? H3? Reach? Because that's how Halo is balanced. You spawn with the best precision weapon in order to properly contest sniper and fight on even ground off spawn.
  • Upvote (+1) 3

Share this post


Link to post

Step 1:

Team Arena to conclude only official game type and map combinations .

 

Step 2:

Remove storm rifle and SMG from this playlist.

 

Step 3:

Re-balance the pistol vs. rifles. Either buff the pistol or make the rifles harder to shoot with advantages only in long range combat. Remove the assault rifle headshot bonus. 

 

Step 4:

Improve the hitboxes while thrusting and remove or reduce significantly the melee magnetism and spartan charge magnetism. 

 

Step 5: 

Consider adding 1-2 forge maps to the rotation and adjust the current maps in forge. Example: Block the maze-area entirely on Coliseum to make sniper side less cluttered and more predictable. 

 

My favourite post so far. So many important points.

Share this post


Link to post

Ideally, we would have a utility weapon that, with perfect shots, beats every other non-power weapon in the game but is so difficult to use that perfect kills are very rare. If your opponent has a SR/SMG and you have a Magnum, assuming perfect aim on both sides, you should win every single time. Getting a perfect kill with the hardest weapon in the game should be extremely rewarding.

  • Upvote (+1) 4

Share this post


Link to post

I didn't enjoy any of those games (except for CE) with default spawns.  I didn't enjoy reach for multiple other reasons (birth of loadouts, Sword Base).  All the other games the community had to fix it first. This is the first Halo since CE that actually has a good weapon as the default spawn weapon and i like to play it with default settings, at least as far as weapons are concerned (radar makes me throw up in my mouth a little).  That's a huge correction from where Halo has been recently.   Halo has never had a particularly deep weapon sandbox and now thats gotten better too.  I fail to see how that's a bad thing, but i do see how buffing the pistol to be the single best weapon would destroy weapon variety and basically make half the sandbox useless.

 

Do balance changes need to be made? of course, im not going to say i think its perfect as is.  Anybody who has their eyes open can see that.  Do i think that part of that balancing could be buffing the pistol? Absolutely.  But do i think that making the magnum the single best weapon in the game at the expense of all the others is a good idea or "balanced"?  Absolutely not.

Share this post


Link to post

I didn't enjoy any of those games (except for CE) with default spawns. I didn't enjoy reach for multiple other reasons (birth of loadouts, Sword Base). All the other games the community had to fix it first. This is the first Halo since CE that actually has a good weapon as the default spawn weapon and i like to play it with default settings, at least as far as weapons are concerned (radar makes me throw up in my mouth a little). That's a huge correction from where Halo has been recently. Halo has never had a particularly deep weapon sandbox and now thats gotten better too. I fail to see how that's a bad thing, but i do see how buffing the pistol to be the single best weapon would destroy weapon variety and basically make half the sandbox useless.

 

Do balance changes need to be made? of course, im not going to say i think its perfect as is. Anybody who has their eyes open can see that. Do i think that part of that balancing could be buffing the pistol? Absolutely. But do i think that making the magnum the single best weapon in the game at the expense of all the others is a good idea or "balanced"? Absolutely not.

Except Halo 5 doesn't have a deep sandbox. At all. It is not a good idea to have weapons that are straight upgrades to your starting weapon. That just causes random outcomes in fights. Fights are now being determined by who had what weapon instead of who outshot/outplayed who. DMR is literally just a better pistol and the same goes for AR/SMG/SR too. That's not deep that's just dumb. Deep is things like the SR doing extra shield damage, or the PP, and even the hydra. More weapons doesn't mean it's deep. Halo 5 has a very diluted sandbox.

 

But hey, if you want weak starting weapons that's your prerogative. I want a strong utility weapon start not a weak ass pistol.

  • Upvote (+1) 4

Share this post


Link to post

Except Halo 5 doesn't have a deep sandbox. At all. It is not a good idea to have weapons that are straight upgrades to your starting weapon. That just causes random outcomes in fights. Fights are now being determined by who had what weapon instead of who outshot/outplayed who. DMR is literally just a better pistol and the same goes for AR/SMG/SR too. That's not deep that's just dumb. Deep is things like the SR doing extra shield damage, or the PP, and even the hydra. More weapons doesn't mean it's deep. Halo 5 has a very diluted sandbox.

 

But hey, if you want weak starting weapons that's your prerogative. I want a strong utility weapon start not a weak ass pistol.

More stuff == More depth.

Share this post


Link to post

Except Halo 5 doesn't have a deep sandbox. At all. It is not a good idea to have weapons that are straight upgrades to your starting weapon. That just causes random outcomes in fights. Fights are now being determined by who had what weapon instead of who outshot/outplayed who. DMR is literally just a better pistol and the same goes for AR/SMG/SR too. That's not deep that's just dumb. Deep is things like the SR doing extra shield damage, or the PP, and even the hydra. More weapons doesn't mean it's deep. Halo 5 has a very diluted sandbox.

 

But hey, if you want weak starting weapons that's your prerogative. I want a strong utility weapon start not a weak ass pistol.

i never said it was deep, i said it was better than previous games.  ie more weapons that you can actually kill with with different characteristics, which is true.  I 100% agree that quantity =/= quality, and i never made any argument otherwise.  My only argument was that the way to fix the whole sandbox isn't to just buff the pistol to make everything else obsolete.  There are a lot of weapons in this game that if tweaked properly could all be useful and worthy of being picked up but not "straight upgrades" as you say.

  • Upvote (+1) 1

Share this post


Link to post

i never said it was deep, i said it was better than previous games.  ie more weapons that you can actually kill with with different characteristics, which is true.  I 100% agree that quantity =/= quality, and i never made any argument otherwise.  My only argument was that the way to fix the whole sandbox isn't to just buff the pistol to make everything else obsolete.  There are a lot of weapons in this game that if tweaked properly could all be useful and worthy of being picked up but not "straight upgrades" as you say.

Even if you buff the pistol and make it a 4sk it still wouldn't make the other weapon obsolete, it would just make the pistol not so terrible. 

Share this post


Link to post

Is there anywhere we can take a poll to see which changes the community wants to implement the most?

Share this post


Link to post

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

×

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use.