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Halo World Championship 2016 Teams, Seeds, and Discussion‏

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HCS Thread Broke 4MM lifetime views

 

:weback:

4 whole Millimeters? Holy SHIT!

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and to only focus on the negatives doesn't do this community any favors but that's your choice.

Well, as I said, how I personally feel about this has precisely zero influence on how it all goes down. Which is why I don't feel terribly guilty about voicing my concerns. 

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However hard you want to minimize radar's impact on the game, it is completely unacceptable to allow for the possibility that a 50-49 winning kill was made because someone stood still and let a guy run past them for an easy assassination when that player would never have otherwise known that opponent was going to flank.

that is an incredibly specific example that will rarely actually happen  :lxthul:

 

but how does the presence of radar change this situation at all? the only difference is that the player standing still wouldn't know the player is going towards him but as soon as the player appeared he'd know anyways. with or without radar, the player shouldn't walk into an area where an enemy might be lurking without being cautious

 

my point isn't that radar should or shouldn't be in the game, but that saying things like "it is completely unacceptable..." is a good way to invalidate your argument. radar changes the game, but i think it's possible to argue that it changes it in a good way

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That's not the same kind of stalemate. Slayer stalemates are both teams sitting around waiting for the other team to make a move/mistake. Flag stalemates are where both flags are out, but you still have both teams actively attempting to defend/return. Slayer stalemates, for me, are incredibly boring. Flag stalemates, on the other hand, are very tense and often lead to incredibly clutch plays.

 

Oh I don't disagree, I'm fully aware. But it's still a stalemate no matter how you spin it, regardless of how interesting it is (love watching it, hate being in it lol). Slayer stalemates really only happen at nail-biter 1-3 kill games. Which don't happen that often as people make it seem.

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Honestly, I'm really surprised people aren't a little upset in here about how the pools worked out. Denial and EG were 2 of the top-4 and they had the same pool, along with a very good NV team. NV was basically punished for their high seed, and it's because the seeds weren't very representative of who the best teams were. Honestly, I'm thankful for X-games effectively roster-locking the top-6 teams or it would have been even worse.

 

Take a page out of the HCS handbook and lock the rosters earlier in the season, (I'd say around OQ #3 would have been perfect) that way we have a few tournaments with the actual final rosters. The other thing I would do is bump the point totals up a bit as the qualifiers go on. As the qualifiers progressed the placings were a lot more representative/accurate, and IMO they should be worth more for that reason.

 

IDK, just a few ideas to hopefully get the best possible teams into the later stages in HWC #2. Overall, I would say there's only one team in the top-8 who shouldn't be there, but there's always room for improvement.

I agree with you for the most part but I'm not sure there's anything to be super upset about. It could have been set up better but it wasn't total BS.

 

  • The rules spelled out how pools work and were posted well before competition started
  • Plenty of teams thought they were too good to grind the ladder. This made the seeding for OQ1 pretty random and contributed to the terrible brackets that teams like OpTic and WFX had to deal with all season. I would like to see more incentive to play ladder matches next go around, but how do you get teams to play an equal amount without having the ladder points overshadow the OQ points?
  • Lag out DQs really suck but there isn't a clear cut solution to the problem. Cheating in online tournaments is a real factor. I'm sure everyone would like to see five LAN qualifiers but having a LAN is not cheap and it's understandable if 343 didn't want to throw a bunch of money at them that early in the life of the game given Halo's overall place in the world.
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On the current topic.

 

If i and many others were content with regionals are getting to complacent, it must be news to me because i distinctly remember spamming 343 to get rid of breakout. Rome wast built in a day, while some aspects of h5 need work that shouldn't takeaway from the fact that the tourny i watched was pretty damn good in spite of it. There needs to be a balance between praise and critique. Too much from either side is just as unproductive.

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that is an incredibly specific example that will rarely actually happen  :lxthul:

 

but how does the presence of radar change this situation at all? the only difference is that the player standing still wouldn't know the player is going towards him but as soon as the player appeared he'd know anyways. with or without radar, the player shouldn't walk into an area where an enemy might be lurking without being cautious

 

my point isn't that radar should or shouldn't be in the game, but that saying things like "it is completely unacceptable..." is a good way to invalidate your argument.

Bloom is completely unacceptable. Is my anti-bloom argument invalidated?

 

How can you say that we should be discouraging aggressive actions? That's exactly the kind of play we want to see in Halo, we want players being able to challenge and approach their enemies in creative ways, and radar makes it far more difficult because it absolves players of their responsibility to cover their surroundings.

 

radar changes the game, but i think it's possible to argue that it changes it in a good way

 

The arguments we have yet to see.

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Apologies if this was already posted, but Snakebite has a hilarious video on his twitch where he goes 48-9 on Fathom CTF playing with randoms on a smurf against other champ/onyx, and he's having a conversation with his viewers for pretty much every minute of it. Worth a view, IMO, I greatly enjoyed it.

 

http://www.twitch.tv/snakebite/v/43623733

 

EDIT: trigger warning... he agrees with my take on autos, in that they're fine but the respawn times are very OP.

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Back on topic...which player has the best radar-watching awareness? Also, did anyone stand out with knowing when to switch from their pistol to their ar?

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Back on topic...which player has the best radar-watching awareness? Also, did anyone stand out with knowing when to switch from their pistol to their ar?

Turning a corner into a tight space is always a great time to switch .

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that's an excellent point, probably won't happen

 

i'm just starved for those optic views :simms:

 

@@NavG123 can you stop being an ass? thanks

no....I don't think its possible for him to.

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huke has the best radar awareness, it was actually so impressive I had to comment on it when a group of us were watching him against liquid. I don't think he ever misses anyone on his radar and his movement is super fast and precise when he sees people on his radar and he's trying to get in a position to either avoid someone or kill them. Def some of that cod radar watching transferring over.

Nice thanks!

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I agree with you for the most part but I'm not sure there's anything to be super upset about. It could have been set up better but it wasn't total BS.

 

  • The rules spelled out how pools work and were posted well before competition started
  • Plenty of teams thought they were too good to grind the ladder. This made the seeding for OQ1 pretty random and contributed to the terrible brackets that teams like OpTic and WFX had to deal with all season. I would like to see more incentive to play ladder matches next go around, but how do you get teams to play an equal amount without having the ladder points overshadow the OQ points?
  • Lag out DQs really suck but there isn't a clear cut solution to the problem. Cheating in online tournaments is a real factor. I'm sure everyone would like to see five LAN qualifiers but having a LAN is not cheap and it's understandable if 343 didn't want to throw a bunch of money at them that early in the life of the game given Halo's overall place in the world.

 

I'm definitely not trying to excuse the teams like WFX and OG who dug themselves a hole (though optic finished with the second most ladder-wins, might be something to consider). I'm pretty sure WFX had fewer ladder wins than I did, so I would say they earned their tough pool, but the low seeds of teams like Denial and ELV made things significantly tougher for teams like NV and Noble (and significantly easier for the 3 teams in pool A).

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Turning a corner into a tight space is always a great time to switch .

I know, but I wanted to know who was the best at making those split-second decisions

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Why's that? Closer we get to faster kill times, the greater plays we can see out of individuals = better viewing experience.

the pistol is just fine the way it is

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Bloom is completely unacceptable. Is my anti-bloom argument invalidated?

 

How can you say that we should be discouraging aggressive actions? That's exactly the kind of play we want to see in Halo, we want players being able to challenge and approach their enemies in creative ways, and radar makes it far more difficult because it absolves players of their responsibility to cover their surroundings.

 

 

The arguments we have yet to see.

if you don't support your argument with evidence then yeah, it's invalidated. you kinda need evidence to support an argument...

 

if you wanna argue that radar sucks, you can't just talk about one specific instance in which it discourages aggressive action. going back to your original situation, it's probable that without radar the person pushing wouldn't even push to begin with because they would be more unsure of whether or not there is a person in that area. have you seen close lockout games in h2a? players camp each tower and wait for the other player to push, that sounds pretty boring to me. with radar one team could bait out a reaction by approaching a tower then having someone else cover them with sniper

 

radar makes it so that aggressive players can be more aware of their surroundings and therefore in encourages more aggressive play. radar allows for crazy plays where someone can crouch behind the enemy's flag stand on coliseum while they're running the other flag in, shoot a rocket to stop the enemy flag runner, go for the return, and then go for a counter cap. that sounds like a pretty interesting play to me. radar discourages short range flanks but it encourages aggressive positioning such as being top center on regret

 

the argument exists. not many people wanna make it and i'm not advocating for it either but suggesting it doesn't exist only serves to make you sound ignorant

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if you don't support your argument with evidence then yeah, it's invalidated. you kinda need evidence to support an argument...

 

if you wanna argue that radar sucks, you can't just talk about one specific instance in which it discourages aggressive action. going back to your original situation, it's probable that without radar the person pushing wouldn't even push to begin with because they would be more unsure of whether or not there is a person in that area. have you seen close lockout games in h2a? players camp each tower and wait for the other player to push, that sounds pretty boring to me. with radar one team could bait out a reaction by approaching a tower then having someone else cover them with sniper

...I'm sorry, did you seriously just argue that radar would make Lockout TS better?

 

I literally don't even know what to say to that.

 

radar makes it so that aggressive players can be more aware of their surroundings and therefore in encourages more aggressive play. radar allows for crazy plays where someone can crouch behind the enemy's flag stand on coliseum while they're running the other flag in, shoot a rocket to stop the enemy flag runner, go for the return, and then go for a counter cap. that sounds like a pretty interesting play to me. radar discourages short range flanks but it encourages aggressive positioning such as being top center on regret

You just argued that camping is a good thing in Halo.

 

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He got ninja'd but won the tournament and I think that about covers the only response he should give it

Oh yea, I saw that. Him saying "the incident" made it sound more serious than a ninja. Lol 

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