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Vetoed

Issues w/ Halo 5 FFA

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Yesterday, I got champion 1 with 17% win rate. I was top 3 in the majority of games so it really sucks to have such a low win rate :(

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Spawn protection is dumb. No competitive game should have it. It works BOTH ways. If someone spawns and shoots you and they're invincible that's lame.

 

If you spawn into shots that's just the nature of FFA. It should be avoided if possible, but I don't think LOS stuff should be implemented.

 

I think all that's needed is to decrease the chance of spawning into an area that is occupied, however don't make it the FURTHEST spawn from the action. just make it random.

 

Also, if FFA is dropped to 6 players the spawn time can be decreased to 5 seconds.

I could not disagree more about the fact spawning into shots is the nature of FFA. Not to mention in 99% of those situations you're expected to fight back using the pistol and not an AR, so you have to switch between weapons and give the opponents some free shots on you before you're even able to react at all.

 

Here's an example of getting spawn trapped. Feel free to explain to me how that is in the nature of FFA, what other options I had, what I could have done better (except using thrusters in a different direction on the second part):

 

http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/Vetoed/video/12449542

 

What you need to realize is this: In FFA, people are always respawning, especially in Halo 5. The respawn timers are long, the engagement are shorts, and the time dedicated to map movement is even shorter. As you spawn everyone away from the action (also read: other players), then eventually, some people will spawn "between" other players (not trapped, just with two different routes to find a potential fight) which will distribute the battles evenly across the map, but rarely leave free clean-ups for people who just got off spawn, and also rarely get a respawning player spawn killed. 

 

It rarely if ever results in some unlucky people having to travel forever across the map. I'd say that part doesn't even matter this much because all the maps have been pretty small except maybe Plaza. I also have no idea why Truth isn't in FFA when Midship was regarded as the ultimate FFA map either.

 

And sure, we could toy with the respawn time as the player count is lowered, but it seems to be consistent across the board and while I don't understand the logic behind it, it seems unlikely that it's going to change. If something like that was, I'd much rather change the radar range to something that prevents it from being useless in FFA.

 

Also I saw @@GH057ayame post in the Halo 5 GD earlier and forgot to tag him in the OP, so I'll do it just in hopes of getting someone's attention regarding this.

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I could not disagree more about the fact spawning into shots is the nature of FFA. Not to mention in 99% of those situations you're expected to fight back using the pistol and not an AR, so you have to switch between weapons and give the opponents some free shots on you before you're even able to react at all.

 

Here's an example of getting spawn trapped. Feel free to explain to me how that is in the nature of FFA, what other options I had, what I could have done better (except using thrusters in a different direction on the second part):

 

http://xboxdvr.com/gamer/Vetoed/video/12449542

 

What you need to realize is this: In FFA, people are always respawning, especially in Halo 5. The respawn timers are long, the engagement are shorts, and the time dedicated to map movement is even shorter. As you spawn everyone away from the action (also read: other players), then eventually, some people will spawn "between" other players (not trapped, just with two different routes to find a potential fight) which will distribute the battles evenly across the map, but rarely leave free clean-ups for people who just got off spawn, and also rarely get a respawning player spawn killed.

 

It rarely if ever results in some unlucky people having to travel forever across the map. I'd say that part doesn't even matter this much because all the maps have been pretty small except maybe Plaza. I also have no idea why Truth isn't in FFA when Midship was regarded as the ultimate FFA map either.

 

And sure, we could toy with the respawn time as the player count is lowered, but it seems to be consistent across the board and while I don't understand the logic behind it, it seems unlikely that it's going to change. If something like that was, I'd much rather change the radar range to something that prevents it from being useless in FFA.

 

Also I saw @@GH057ayame post in the Halo 5 GD earlier and forgot to tag him in the OP, so I'll do it just in hopes of getting someone's attention regarding this.

Have you posted anything on waypoint? I know that place is awful, but the more people seeing it the better.
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Have you posted anything on waypoint? I know that place is awful, but the more people seeing it the better.

No, anything that involves breaking down game mechanics at a high level shouldn't be posted on Waypoint. You'll get people arguing for the sake of arguing without understanding what's going on and people telling you that's how it is right now, so it's obviously how it's meant to be played.

 

I might make a Reddit post though. I was just hoping I wouldn't have to since a few key members of 343's team post here already.

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I feel like FFA should just be changed to 15 minutes time limit, highest kills or K/D/A wins. FFA should be more about endurance and consistency than reaching a kill limit. Top 2 1v1 for a any tie breakers:P 

 

Or put in a Tour De Walsh gametype:P (Best warm up ever)

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I feel like FFA should just be changed to 15 minutes time limit, highest kills or K/D/A wins. FFA should be more about endurance and consistency than reaching a kill limit. Top 2 1v1 for a any tie breakers:P 

 

Or put in a Tour De Walsh gametype:P (Best warm up ever)

While it could be a fun alternative, I think it's important not to let matchmade games get tedious or repetitive. A 15 minute match is VERY long for MM, and getting the same map twice or even three times in a row could result in people getting burnt out quick. I don't think FFA should ever be above the 10 minute mark for that reason.

 

I'd love to see an endurance mode where there's a time limit though.

 

As for the overtime in FFA, I haven't seen it happen.

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While it could be a fun alternative, I think it's important not to let matchmade games get tedious or repetitive. A 15 minute match is VERY long for MM, and getting the same map twice or even three times in a row could result in people getting burnt out quick. I don't think FFA should ever be above the 10 minute mark for that reason.

 

I'd love to see an endurance mode where there's a time limit though.

 

As for the overtime in FFA, I haven't seen it happen.

 

Well my other idea that I just tweeted was an endless drop in/drop out FFA mode. Play as long as you like and just back out when you want. This is supposed to be an esports driven game, what better way to warm up than a Tour De Walsh on Truth 24/7. Also for what little aim assist this game has, people could use the warm up honestly...as well as just getting their shot to be more consistent. Consider it a "sandbox mode" for 1 very important part of Halo. 

 

Idk i'd play it lol

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Well my other idea that I just tweeted was an endless drop in/drop out FFA mode. Play as long as you like and just back out when you want. This is supposed to be an esports driven game, what better way to warm up than a Tour De Walsh on Truth 24/7. Also for what little aim assist this game has, people could use the warm up honestly...as well as just getting their shot to be more consistent. Consider it a "sandbox mode" for 1 very important part of Halo. 

 

Idk i'd play it lol

This could be a really cool concept actually.

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Well my other idea that I just tweeted was an endless drop in/drop out FFA mode. Play as long as you like and just back out when you want. This is supposed to be an esports driven game, what better way to warm up than a Tour De Walsh on Truth 24/7. Also for what little aim assist this game has, people could use the warm up honestly...as well as just getting their shot to be more consistent. Consider it a "sandbox mode" for 1 very important part of Halo.

 

Idk i'd play it lol

Holy shit that's a really good idea.
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Well my other idea that I just tweeted was an endless drop in/drop out FFA mode. Play as long as you like and just back out when you want. This is supposed to be an esports driven game, what better way to warm up than a Tour De Walsh on Truth 24/7. Also for what little aim assist this game has, people could use the warm up honestly...as well as just getting their shot to be more consistent. Consider it a "sandbox mode" for 1 very important part of Halo. 

 

Idk i'd play it lol

Definitely a good idea, and I know I bring up CS a lot, but pretty much every pro uses Deathmatch FFA to maintain their consistency and you meet EU pros every day on BrutalCS' servers (e.g. NiP, Fnatic, TSM, Dignitas, etc).

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Have you posted anything on waypoint? I know that place is awful, but the more people seeing it the better.

 

No, anything that involves breaking down game mechanics at a high level shouldn't be posted on Waypoint. You'll get people arguing for the sake of arguing without understanding what's going on and people telling you that's how it is right now, so it's obviously how it's meant to be played.

 

I might make a Reddit post though. I was just hoping I wouldn't have to since a few key members of 343's team post here already.

Didn't take long.

 

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I think you all have very valid points. Anyone running customs to see if any of these changes could make things better? 

 

I just have to chime in on the player count issue. I agree that 6 players would be preferable to 8 but I think the problem it is also largely dependent on the map. Plaza feels like you're constantly either spawned in the middle of a firefight or getting shot by someone who spawns directly behind you. I tried watching video of my own matches to figure out how to anticipate where people are going to spawn but it hasn't helped. Eden, on the other hand, doesn't seem as bad. I don't know if it has to do with the fact that the map is symmetrical or not but I find that I have a better sense of when someone is creeping up on me and I can react appropriately. Thoughts? 

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I don't understand the ranks..

I won 9/10 games and I have close to a 3.0 KD in arena, but I got put in what I think is a bad rank? 

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The current FFA settings are borderline unplayable.

 

How the fuck you put overshield and rockets in an FFA gametype is beyond me.

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The radar in FFA is so fucked up. The spawns are also ridiculously stupid, I get killed by someone who spawns behind me way too much... (Radar could fix this issue, maybe?) 

 

Another thing about the radar is it doesn't tell you if someone is below or above you, someone on these forums told me that it does, but after playing Halo 5 for enough hours I can definitely say I can't tell. 

 

Reach had a great radar system, if someone was above or below you, their dot was faded, they should bring that back.

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The 18 meter radar kills FFA and radar gametypes as a whole.  Someone could be 5 feet from you and they still don't pop up on radar, I'm enjoying FFA right now don't get me wrong but the radar makes the maps kinda play inconsistent.

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I was playing FFA yesterday and needless to say, the OP hits the nail on the head. I felt games were incredibly random yet I somehow placed onyx so I must have done something right, yet I honestly never felt truly in control for more than maybe 10% of a match unless I was playing complete noobs.

The gameplay itself didn't feel enjoyable at all. AR warrioring is even more rampant than 4v4, and the amount of situations that you spawn in where either you or your opponent get a trivial kill makes the whole game feel like a dice roll.

 

I feel like the Rig is the worst offender of this. All those corners and seven other guys sprinting the hell out of every nook and cranny of the map makes for some wildly random games.

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What's upsetting is I was really looking forward to halo 5 ffa. Just making it 6 players would make me want to play it again.

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I want to enjoy FFA in H5, because when I'm not being driven in to the dirt with spawn camping, I see so much potential in it. I want it to be the playlist I can grind when none of my buddies are on, but in its current state, there's just too high of a frustration level for me to get on board with it.

Good post, @Vetoed. Hope someone higher up sees this.

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