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Halo 5: Guardians eSports/Arena Weapon Starts Poll

Arena Starting Weapons (constructive post gamescom thread)  

850 members have voted

  1. 1. Exports/Arena Starting Weapon Choices

    • Pistol + AR
    • Pistol + AR (AR nerfed)
    • Pistol + AR (Pistol patched to 4SK)
    • BR + Pistol
    • BR only
    • BR + AR
    • BR + AR (AR nerfed)
    • DMR Only / With AR (Is it viable over any of the above?)
    • Pistol Only


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After watching a bunch of gameplay, I may have to go with AR/Magnum after seeing how effective the Magnum is (I'm still a BR rooter at heart though). Also does anyone know its TTK vs the BR?

 

It also seems like the SMG no longer has any bloom but has much higher recoil than in the beta. I think I'm cool with that change.

 

One thing I am concerned with is the abundance of automatic weapons. We already had The AR/SR/Repeater/SAW, and now we have the SMG back. In an MP environment I'm not really sure what distinct roles they're all supposed to play in relation to one another now that there are so many.

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Looking at the precision weapon play again, Pistol doesn't really need a buff. Yes, it's harder to use than BR & DMR, but I never saw a situation where one team locked down all the BRs, ala H2 SMG starts. (Of course, a 4sk pistol would be great, but it's not necessary/likely). 

 

The big problem I see is the AR. It's completely inferior to the SMG. There's no reason to keep your AR over an SMG, and its kill time is a bit fast compared to the Pistol.

 

Assuming no 4sk pistol (as there'll probably be a 3sk pistol, and Quinn's vote), there are 2 things that are needed for AR/Pistol starts to work:

 

1) SMG range decreased, more bloom and recoil. This was probably a bug for gamescom, hopefully they've fixed it since then. Also reduce the damage done, or decrease the # on map, and frequency.

 

2) Nerf AR power a bit, and improve its range. Should have better range than SMG, and less power than Pistol. 

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Looking at the precision weapon play again, Pistol doesn't really need a buff. Yes, it's harder to use than BR & DMR, but I never saw a situation where one team locked down all the BRs, ala H2 SMG starts. (Of course, a 4sk pistol would be great, but it's not necessary/likely).

 

The big problem I see is the AR. It's completely inferior to the SMG. There's no reason to keep your AR over an SMG, and its kill time is a bit fast compared to the Pistol.

 

Assuming no 4sk pistol (as there'll probably be a 3sk pistol, and Quinn's vote), there are 2 things that are needed for AR/Pistol starts to work:

 

1) SMG range decreased, more bloom and recoil. This was probably a bug for gamescom, hopefully they've fixed it since then. Also reduce the damage done, or decrease the # on map, and frequency.

 

2) Nerf AR power a bit, and improve its range. Should have better range than SMG, and less power than Pistol.

Yeah SMG should be more dominant up close, AR should have Range advantage. I'm sure if bloom comes back this will be the case. Otherwise SMG needs more smart scope recoil and a reduced RRR

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I've always wondered why people are so hell-bent on putting the AR in competitive settings now.

H3 and Reach showed that nothing was ever missing if you didn't include the AR at all.

H4 and H2A showed that you can put the AR on the map if its strong enough and people will put it to use, giving you one more potential advantage over the other team.

But now all of a sudden people feel that they absolutely have to include the ar in the starting weapon set? We all know what starting with automatics in halo plays like, and this is no different ( imo even worse) in Halo 5.

Anything good automatics bring to the table is more than covered by making them pickups on the map, yet now people are debating on how the whole game needs to be changed just so we can do AR starts. (i.e 4 sk pistol, less AR damage/range etc)

 

Hint: "Casuals" aren't going to be playing "competitive settings" no matter what the starting weapon is.

 

It's the same thing with all this talk about the weapon "balance" (god I hate that term) where (for whatever reason) all the non-powerweapons absolutely have to be picked up at all times.

There are way too many weapons in Halo 5 , and (ironically) way too few that actually do something meaningful and unique. What's the point of having ARs/Smgs/Storm rifles/Dmrs/Brs/Lightrifles all on the map when all those weapons boil down to nothing but variations of two weapon types?

Some of you people are making this way more complicated than it needs to be.

 

Edit: awful grammar

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that makes no sense. you cant speek for all the people who voted that way so dont even try that bs. fact is the options with pistols got more votes, deal with it.

No, the options with BR's got more votes. One more to be exact, deal with it :kappa:

On a serious note though it does kinda make sense. A 5 shot kill pistol isn't ideal so voting for a 4sk BR would be the next option, and having the pistol in your back pocket doesn't have any negative implications for competitive Halo. I wouldn't mind watching pros using both just to change things up a bit, but watching them use an AR is stale and it doesn't support skill shooting.

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No, the options with BR's got more votes. One more to be exact, deal with it :kappa:

 

You were either dropped on your head as a child, suck at math, or are cherry picking the numbers you choose, because  the Pistol options have more votes. Deal with it.

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Even if the Magnum isn't given the 4sk buff, I'm pretty sure it isn't impossible asking for a rate-of-fire buff. I would be happy with either change, personally.

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I've always wondered why people are so hell-bent on putting the AR in competitive settings now.

H3 and Reach showed that nothing was ever missing if you didn't include the AR at all.

H4 and H2A showed that you can put the AR on the map if its strong enough and people will put it to use, giving you one more potential advantage over the other team.

But now all of a sudden people feel that they absolutely have to include the ar in the starting weapon set? We all know what starting with automatics in halo plays like, and this is no different ( imo even worse) in Halo 5.

Anything good automatics bring to the table is more than covered by making them pickups on the map, yet now people are debating on how the whole game needs to be changed just so we can do AR starts. (i.e 4 sk pistol, less AR damage/range etc)

 

Hint: "Casuals" aren't going to be playing "competitive settings" no matter what the starting weapon is.

 

It's just some dumb new community fad. In Reach it was forge maps, in H4 it was denial about just how bad the game's mechanics were and refusal to nuke the sandbox and start from scratch, now it's ARs and the moronic belief that AR starts = more viewers.

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You were either dropped on your head as a child, suck at math, or are cherry picking the numbers you choose, because  the Pistol options have more votes. Deal with it.

That depends on how you counted the BR/Pistol votes.

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You were either dropped on your head as a child, suck at math, or are cherry picking the numbers you choose, because  the Pistol options have more votes. Deal with it.

No need for that.

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It's just some dumb new community fad.

Honestly? I wouldn't agree with that.

 

For the first time in 14 years, we have a Halo game where the default settings are near perfect. Imagine if the SMG and Pistol in H2 were balanced almost the same way as AR/Magnum in CE. Imagine H3. We wouldn't be having all this debate if Bungie stayed smart and made the default settings the most balanced and competitive settings. This "new fad" has been talked about since H2. People were disappointed that Bungie didn't get their magic right on the sequel, or the next sequel, or the prequel. Now that we have promise of true, balanced settings for the competitive and casual community as a single start again, these people are coming back and voting for it.

 

Automatics have never been put into competitive settings to H2 and onward not because of their different method of use (aka "unskillful"), but because they were considered useless. AR lost its power, Plasma Weapons lost their stun, the SMG was a pellet pooper. But now? They are useful again. On the map, they are now viable pickups. The one in your hand, alongside the trusty Magnum, is the most challenging one to use, because it requires more trigger and recoil control than the others. It can become the situational weapon it was in H1, and if H1 could do it, so can Guardians.

 

Retention for the competitive aspect of the game will definitely be better than we expect. Casuals, even back in the H2 days, were discouraged to try to learn BR starts and MLG settings for a long time, simply because the maps were changed to suit the "hardcore." The viewership and longevity of the games of old would have been better if the settings were balanced, and the only change between comp/casual was turning off the radar. The longevity of H5 will also plummet if the settings are drastically changed for the umpteenth time.

 

AR/Magnum starts truly are the only starts that will benefit Halo 5 as a whole.

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Honestly? I wouldn't agree with that.

 

For the first time in 14 years, we have a Halo game where the default settings are near perfect. Imagine if the SMG and Pistol in H2 were balanced almost the same way as AR/Magnum in CE. Imagine H3. We wouldn't be having all this debate if Bungie stayed smart and made the default settings the most balanced and competitive settings. This "new fad" has been talked about since H2. People were disappointed that Bungie didn't get their magic right on the sequel, or the next sequel, or the prequel. Now that we have promise of true, balanced settings for the competitive and casual community as a single start again, these people are coming back and voting for it.

 

Automatics have never been put into competitive settings to H2 and onward not because of their different method of use (aka "unskillful"), but because they were considered useless. AR lost its power, Plasma Weapons lost their stun, the SMG was a pellet pooper. But now? They are useful again. On the map, they are now viable pickups. The one in your hand, alongside the trusty Magnum, is the most challenging one to use, because it requires more trigger and recoil control than the others. It can become the situational weapon it was in H1, and if H1 could do it, so can Guardians.

 

Retention for the competitive aspect of the game will definitely be better than we expect. Casuals, even back in the H2 days, were discouraged to try to learn BR starts and MLG settings for a long time, simply because the maps were changed to suit the "hardcore." The viewership and longevity of the games of old would have been better if the settings were balanced, and the only change between comp/casual was turning off the radar. The longevity of H5 will also plummet if the settings are drastically changed for the umpteenth time.

 

AR/Magnum starts truly are the only starts that will benefit Halo 5 as a whole.

 

 

 

The claim that competitive settings and casual settings have to be the same to "enhance retention" is the biggest fairy tale in Halo.

 

Who came up with this and when?

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Honestly? I wouldn't agree with that.

 

For the first time in 14 years, we have a Halo game where the default settings are near perfect. Imagine if the SMG and Pistol in H2 were balanced almost the same way as AR/Magnum in CE. Imagine H3. We wouldn't be having all this debate if Bungie stayed smart and made the default settings the most balanced and competitive settings. This "new fad" has been talked about since H2. People were disappointed that Bungie didn't get their magic right on the sequel, or the next sequel, or the prequel. Now that we have promise of true, balanced settings for the competitive and casual community as a single start again, these people are coming back and voting for it.

 

Automatics have never been put into competitive settings to H2 and onward not because of their different method of use (aka "unskillful"), but because they were considered useless. AR lost its power, Plasma Weapons lost their stun, the SMG was a pellet pooper. But now? They are useful again. On the map, they are now viable pickups. The one in your hand, alongside the trusty Magnum, is the most challenging one to use, because it requires more trigger and recoil control than the others. It can become the situational weapon it was in H1, and if H1 could do it, so can Guardians.

 

Retention for the competitive aspect of the game will definitely be better than we expect. Casuals, even back in the H2 days, were discouraged to try to learn BR starts and MLG settings for a long time, simply because the maps were changed to suit the "hardcore." The viewership and longevity of the games of old would have been better if the settings were balanced, and the only change between comp/casual was turning off the radar. The longevity of H5 will also plummet if the settings are drastically changed for the umpteenth time.

 

AR/Magnum starts truly are the only starts that will benefit Halo 5 as a whole.

 

"Near perfect" doesn't cut it when one piece (the AR) is still a net negative on the game and can be quickly and painlessly removed with no real consequence. The AR does absolutely nothing for the game from a competitive standpoint. I've already explained why the casuals-will-watch-because-AR thing is a load of crap, but I guess I could explain it again because why not.

 

Casuals will tune into competitive matches for one of two reasons:

 

1) They want to be entertained. In which case they could give a flying rat fuck whether the AR is being used or not.

 

2) They want to observe, learn, and get better. In which case the AR being gone doesn't matter either, because it's a gun with a painfully low skill gap. And this type of player has more than likely figured that out and doesn't intend to lean on it too much in their future Halo endeavors.

 

The AR will not help casuals relate to the settings. That's what the maps are for. Anyone out there advocating for AR starts and forged HCS maps has it completely ass-backwards.

 

Oh, and there is nothing "situational" about the AR in Halo 1. It's worthless. It's only used for quick camo, and even then it's not the only weapon that can quick camo, nor is it the fastest. It just happens to be the one players start with because the H1 options don't let you do pistol only starts.

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The claim that competitive settings and casual settings have to be the same to "enhance retention" is the biggest fairy tale in Halo.

 

Who came up with this and when?

 

Like I said, community fad. Flamesword or Gandhi or Bravo starts saying things on youtube or whatever, and next thing you know there's countless forumers out there parroting it in every single discussion.

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You were either dropped on your head as a child, suck at math, or are cherry picking the numbers you choose, because  the Pistol options have more votes. Deal with it.

The BR has more votes when you add them together. I am voting for pistol as is. 

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Like I said, community fad. Flamesword or Gandhi or Bravo starts saying things on youtube or whatever, and next thing you know there's countless forumers out there parroting it in every single discussion.

 

Before 343 even made it clear that AR/Pistol starts would be gamewide, there was a huge thread on here w/ lots of support for it. This is before any big names like FS came out for it...

 

it can work competitively, if we get a rebalancing of the AR vs. Pistol relationship. 

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The BR has more votes when you add them together. I am voting for pistol as is. 

 

Actually you are correct, the BR technically does have more votes all together. But if you put the Pistol votes together it's 196. Not that I advocate Pistol starts where there are clearly more options for pistol starts than BR.

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AR needs to be removed and leave the smg as the only automatic on the map. G needs to still be nerfed further. Pistol needs to be buffed by eother rof increase or by being made a 4sk. As f right it gets destroyed by automatics with little chance of fighting back.

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Each option should be counted alone anyway.

 

I understand why people are doing it but it would make more sense to just do a separate poll for strictly BR vs. Pistol.

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I can definitely say WITH confidence that BR+Pistol left how it is will be perfect.

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Actually you are correct, the BR technically does have more votes all together. But if you put the Pistol votes together it's 196. Not that I advocate Pistol starts where there are clearly more options for pistol starts than BR.

 counting all the options with a pistol (including br + pistol), the pistol has more votes with 298 to the br's 202.

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 counting all the options with a pistol (including br + pistol), the pistol has more votes with 298 to the br's 202.

 

 

Dude... people still vote you know + where'd you get the extra 100 votes from?  :lxthul:

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I would feel detrimental If we played with AR starts honestly.

 

In CSGO as an example AR's require tons of skill. Even in CoD i can appreciate AR's, but just not in Halo.

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Before 343 even made it clear that AR/Pistol starts would be gamewide, there was a huge thread on here w/ lots of support for it. This is before any big names like FS came out for it...

 

it can work competitively, if we get a rebalancing of the AR vs. Pistol relationship. 

 

Yeah, it's not like some of us have been saying it for months.

 

(Piggybacking you, not responding directly to you.)

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